Recap: 2025 Podcasting in the News

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Welcome to Podcast Insider. I'm Mackenzie Bennett, marketing

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director here at Blueberry.

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And I'm Mike Dell, vice president of customer

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relations here at Blueberry.

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And I'm Dave Clements, technical support and social

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media specialist here at Blueberry. And today, as

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we wrap up 2025,

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we're gonna talk about the year and some

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of the things that happened in podcasting.

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You're listening to Podcast Insider, a weekly podcast

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bringing insights, advice, and insider tips and tricks

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to help you start, grow, and thrive through

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podcasting with the support of your team here

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at Blueberry Podcasting. Welcome. Let's dive in.

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And I'd like to congratulate Mackenzie on her

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promotion to marketing director.

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So, that's something that happened just recently here

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in 2025.

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Thank you.

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Rounding out the year well.

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Yeah. So,

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there's a lot of things that happened this

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year,

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you know, in the in the industry.

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And,

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we put together a little list of things

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and, some new stories, which we'll probably have

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links to in the show notes.

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But, why don't you kick it off, Dave?

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Yeah. So kind of our first section here,

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I guess, would be,

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just the market,

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and listening behavior.

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So Riverside

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reports that,

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podcast audience numbers continue to climb.

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In 2025,

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over 584,000,000

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people listen to podcasts

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globally,

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and consumption habits are shifting.

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Yeah. And and what's cool about it is

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thirty four percent in the,

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in The US,

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have listened to podcasts, and, you know, the

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average is, like, eight point something percent

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or 8.3

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podcast episodes per week. So that's a little

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higher than it's been. I'm kind of impressed

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with that.

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Yeah. Those are I think those are pretty

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good numbers.

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And we're definitely seeing video,

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get into the podcast landscape. If anybody's been

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paying attention

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Yeah.

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Video. Video. Video.

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Yeah. YouTube took a big step,

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in 2025.

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So we're seeing a lot of those, and

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Riverside is saying that more than half of

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the shows,

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are now posting full video on YouTube.

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So I think that is from their

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That must be from their, their customer base

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because,

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I we don't see that here. We you

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know? Well, there's a a fair number.

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But, Yeah. That's their platform's

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information, I from what I gather. Yeah. Yeah.

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You know, which makes sense when they do

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video natively,

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but, I think we see it as a

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much smaller percentage.

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Yeah. It it's video is one of those

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things. It takes a lot more work to

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do.

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You know, now with something like Riverside where

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it's kind of all packaged up for you,

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that's it is a little easier.

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But, you know, think about this. You know?

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If I wanna do a podcast and I

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don't feel like shaving or combing my hair

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that morning, I don't you know, if I'm

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doing video, I gotta do all that.

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And, you know, for for women, it's probably

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worse, you know, for, you know, getting ready

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to be camera ready.

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That is correct. Yeah. And, you know, it's

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like, you know, why why do we need

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to do that if you don't want to?

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Now there's nothing at all wrong with that.

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Again, you know, I I I have lots

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of strong opinions. I'll try to keep to

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myself here. But

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I also have strong opinions

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about being the one on video.

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That is not something I have any interest

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in whatsoever.

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And

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it's, you know, it's whatever you're comfortable with

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having your face, your

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your reputation,

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your

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name, everything out there to the public like

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that.

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That's just another that's going video is another

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level past an audio podcast for sure. Right.

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And do what you're good at.

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You know, if you're good at audio but,

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freeze up on a camera, don't turn on

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the camera. I mean, you know, do if

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you wanna do some, like, video clips or

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whatever, do animations

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or slide shows or something like that, you

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know, as far as promotional ways. But,

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you know, you don't have to do video

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or at least you don't have to be

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on camera.

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Yeah. We just published a YouTube video probably

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a month or two ago specifically about,

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video podcasting and should you do it. And

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the conclusion, if you want the TLDR, is

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basically, if you have time,

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do it. If you're comfortable, do it, but

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don't feel like you have to.

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Right. You know, there's plenty of podcasts. You

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know?

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Anecdotally,

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I you know, I don't have any hard

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data on this, but anecdotally,

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podcasts

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listening slash

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viewing. You know? So there's some podcasts that

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I know of that do both a full

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video version and a full audio version,

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via RSS. And via RSS, it's about 10%

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watch the video

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and 90%

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listen to the audio,

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which still is pretty good. You get 10%

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more audience on video, you know, but, you

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know, the the percentage isn't really you know,

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when they say the the juice isn't worth

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the squeeze.

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Yeah. You know? But then, you know, these

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these particular shows also post on YouTube, x,

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Facebook, whatever, so they get some additional views

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that way, which aren't reflected in their podcast

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stats. But still, it's a smaller percentage that

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watch

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rather than listen. And a lot of people

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on YouTube and and,

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one of our teammates, Sean,

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says he's kinda doing that a lot now

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is he does watch the video version of

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a podcast

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on YouTube, but he's generally not looking at

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the screen.

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He's listening

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and doing something else, and every once in

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a while, I might look up at the

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screen.

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So, you know, just because they listen on

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YouTube

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doesn't mean they're actually paying attention to what's

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on the screen. So that's Mhmm. You know,

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just like these are anecdotal. I don't have

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any hard evidence of any of this, but,

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you know, just just my gut feeling and

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from what I've seen.

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But,

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anyway, let's press on here.

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So the industry

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itself

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is is doing good. It's doing well,

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quote, unquote, remains strong.

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There is

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you know,

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we took a dip, I think, just for

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a cup for a year or two there,

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the industry with

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a dip in listeners

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and creators,

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but I think that was you know,

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we spiked,

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in the beginning of 2020

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and into '21, and then things kinda started

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to dip for a while in '22, '23,

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twenty four ish. But this year this year

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was okay. Yeah. That's

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that's good. We're we're gaining podcasters,

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and we're gaining podcast listeners. And, actually, the

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listener side is growing more than the podcaster

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side,

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but, you know, both are doing fine.

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Again,

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you know, the the barrier to entry into

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podcasting,

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especially with just audio, is

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Mhmm. Is it's low now.

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I mean, you can

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jump on Blueberry and in ten minutes, get

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your feed put together, record something.

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All the editing tools are so much better

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than they used to be.

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Oh, yeah. You know, all of that stuff,

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distribution,

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you know, we've we've just revamped our our

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destinations

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to where a lot of those are just

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one click. One click, agree to this, you

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know, hit apply, you're you're on. You know,

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Apple, Spotify, Index, you know, the the three

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major ones, and then all the other ones

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are are fairly easy to do. And, you

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know, that wasn't the case five years ago.

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Yeah. So Yeah. Waiting a week to see

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if you're gonna be on Apple or

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or something like that. Those days are over.

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That's that's pretty quick now. So,

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I I don't know. I I kind of

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expect to see

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more podcasters coming into the space because it

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is easier. You know, we've got microphones that

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plug right into your iPhone that actually sound

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pretty good. Mhmm. They're, you know, maybe not

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studio level,

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but they're probably the equivalent to what we

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were using Good enough. Eight years ago.

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Good enough. They're not the yeah. They're not

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the stick microphones that sounded like you talking

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into a wet paper bag.

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Or,

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earbuds like, Dave was last week on this

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up on this show.

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Yeah. I just gotta pick on you a

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little bit. Didn't sound bad.

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You know, one of the other things I've

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seen,

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is ads.

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You know, the

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the thing about ads

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is, you know, they're

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like, Edison came out with

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a research that people don't mind listening to

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ads. Well, you didn't talk to me. I

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promise you.

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You know? I I understand the need for

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ads. I understand, you know, our casters gotta

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make money,

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you know, if they wanna keep doing this,

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you know, and there's businesses out there that

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that's what they do is, make money from

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ads on podcast. I get that.

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And I will put up with a certain

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amount of that, but

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some of it is getting to the point

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of ridiculous.

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Sorry. I had a rant on my regular

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show the other day about that.

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Anyway

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but,

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you know, creators and podcast networks exploring different

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monetization

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strategies other than ads, like, subscriptions,

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listener support sponsorships,

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value for value, not the Bitcoin kind, but

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just, you know, we provide value, send us

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some money for the value, you know, that

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kind of thing.

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Yeah. I'd much rather do that than get

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involved in Bitcoin.

274
00:10:16,820 --> 00:10:18,919
Yeah. Exactly. You know? But, you know,

275
00:10:19,460 --> 00:10:20,899
I I do that. I have a couple

276
00:10:20,899 --> 00:10:21,720
of Patreon

277
00:10:22,340 --> 00:10:24,820
people that I support because I like their

278
00:10:24,820 --> 00:10:27,000
YouTube channel or I like their podcast.

279
00:10:28,154 --> 00:10:30,574
And that's a much better way than getting

280
00:10:30,714 --> 00:10:32,014
a whole bunch of ads.

281
00:10:32,794 --> 00:10:34,394
And, you know, and then it works out

282
00:10:34,394 --> 00:10:37,434
for the creators too. But ads are fine.

283
00:10:37,434 --> 00:10:39,115
Again, you know, if that's what you wanna

284
00:10:39,115 --> 00:10:41,120
do, do it. You know, we have some

285
00:10:41,120 --> 00:10:43,120
tools to help you get ads for your

286
00:10:43,120 --> 00:10:43,860
show, and

287
00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:46,879
and, you know, it's all good. But, again,

288
00:10:46,879 --> 00:10:49,040
you know, there's a certain number of audience

289
00:10:49,040 --> 00:10:50,480
members that are not gonna put up with

290
00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:50,980
that.

291
00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:53,394
So I think part of my

292
00:10:54,014 --> 00:10:54,834
ad reasoning,

293
00:10:55,855 --> 00:10:57,235
you know, whether I'm on

294
00:10:58,574 --> 00:11:00,975
the the okay side or the annoyed side

295
00:11:00,975 --> 00:11:02,814
of it is what is the quality of

296
00:11:02,814 --> 00:11:04,674
this episode that I'm listening to

297
00:11:05,214 --> 00:11:07,289
and overall the show as well.

298
00:11:09,449 --> 00:11:11,690
If if it doesn't sound great, if it's

299
00:11:11,690 --> 00:11:13,470
not, you know, well

300
00:11:13,850 --> 00:11:16,169
thought out, if they're just kinda rambling, if

301
00:11:16,169 --> 00:11:17,470
they're doing all that stuff,

302
00:11:18,009 --> 00:11:19,949
I'm I'm gonna get sick of the ads.

303
00:11:20,524 --> 00:11:23,004
If it is professionally done, if it sounds

304
00:11:23,004 --> 00:11:25,665
amazing, if it, you know, came out

305
00:11:26,365 --> 00:11:27,264
at a timely

306
00:11:28,045 --> 00:11:30,125
place during the week, like, you know, if

307
00:11:30,125 --> 00:11:31,965
it's news and it's relevant and, like, this

308
00:11:31,965 --> 00:11:34,144
is actually good information I wanted right now,

309
00:11:34,569 --> 00:11:36,409
I don't care if there's ads because this

310
00:11:36,409 --> 00:11:37,069
is free.

311
00:11:37,370 --> 00:11:38,769
Yeah. And some of them do the ads.

312
00:11:38,769 --> 00:11:40,649
It goes back and forth. And some of

313
00:11:40,649 --> 00:11:43,209
them do the ads really well. You know?

314
00:11:43,209 --> 00:11:45,449
Right. And that's that's the other thing. You

315
00:11:45,449 --> 00:11:45,949
know?

316
00:11:46,664 --> 00:11:47,164
There's

317
00:11:47,625 --> 00:11:50,424
some platforms out there that have programmatic ads,

318
00:11:50,424 --> 00:11:51,964
YouTube being one of them,

319
00:11:52,345 --> 00:11:54,264
where if you don't pay YouTube to get

320
00:11:54,264 --> 00:11:56,424
rid of the ads, they you know, somebody's

321
00:11:56,424 --> 00:11:58,504
in the middle of a sentence and this

322
00:11:58,504 --> 00:12:00,524
irrelevant ad comes in there.

323
00:12:00,839 --> 00:12:03,079
Yeah. Now if I'm listening to, you know,

324
00:12:03,079 --> 00:12:04,139
something from,

325
00:12:04,839 --> 00:12:06,279
I don't know, 99%

326
00:12:06,279 --> 00:12:08,279
Invisible is one of the shows I listen

327
00:12:08,279 --> 00:12:10,779
to, and they do the ads really well.

328
00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:13,079
They they read them. You know, you would

329
00:12:13,079 --> 00:12:14,539
think it's part of the show,

330
00:12:14,955 --> 00:12:17,514
and they're always relevant to whatever they're talking

331
00:12:17,514 --> 00:12:20,175
about or at least in the subject matter.

332
00:12:20,634 --> 00:12:22,555
That's exactly what I mean when I say

333
00:12:22,555 --> 00:12:25,115
I don't care. So if if I have

334
00:12:25,115 --> 00:12:27,754
some advice for people who wanna monetize their

335
00:12:27,754 --> 00:12:28,254
show.

336
00:12:29,669 --> 00:12:31,129
Get really good at ads.

337
00:12:31,589 --> 00:12:33,990
You need to practice doing these. This isn't

338
00:12:33,990 --> 00:12:36,629
something that you just throw in. Like, actually

339
00:12:36,629 --> 00:12:40,009
take take time outside of recording the episode

340
00:12:40,309 --> 00:12:42,389
and practice doing these and decide, like, oh,

341
00:12:42,389 --> 00:12:44,625
that one's better than the other. Like, maybe

342
00:12:44,625 --> 00:12:46,065
that we should do it this way type

343
00:12:46,065 --> 00:12:48,325
of thing because, like, you could really

344
00:12:49,184 --> 00:12:51,285
you could be a thorn in someone's listening

345
00:12:51,345 --> 00:12:53,764
experience or you could just be a blip

346
00:12:53,904 --> 00:12:56,404
and, like Yeah. They'll they'll take it.

347
00:12:56,840 --> 00:12:58,519
I think to kind of tack onto that

348
00:12:58,519 --> 00:13:00,600
as well, if you're not interested in actually

349
00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:02,840
taking the time to do the ads, I

350
00:13:02,840 --> 00:13:05,100
guess, what you would call, quote, unquote, right,

351
00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:07,820
maybe you just start a Patreon or,

352
00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:09,660
a coffee or whatever

353
00:13:10,095 --> 00:13:12,735
and do that value for value thing? That's

354
00:13:12,735 --> 00:13:14,674
probably a better way to go.

355
00:13:15,855 --> 00:13:18,095
That way you're you're being more honest with

356
00:13:18,095 --> 00:13:20,334
your audience. I think that was always something

357
00:13:20,334 --> 00:13:22,970
that that was my approach. I don't want

358
00:13:22,970 --> 00:13:24,730
to have to sit there and figure out

359
00:13:24,730 --> 00:13:27,289
how to do an ad well, but I

360
00:13:27,289 --> 00:13:29,470
am putting my all into an episode.

361
00:13:29,929 --> 00:13:32,089
So maybe you give me a dollar a

362
00:13:32,089 --> 00:13:33,230
month on Patreon,

363
00:13:34,169 --> 00:13:35,769
you know, and most of that is coming

364
00:13:35,769 --> 00:13:38,475
to me instead of a very small percentage

365
00:13:38,694 --> 00:13:40,794
coming to me and then going to

366
00:13:41,174 --> 00:13:41,914
the advertiser.

367
00:13:42,294 --> 00:13:44,534
Yeah. And another another way of doing it,

368
00:13:44,694 --> 00:13:46,615
getting ads I don't know. This isn't really

369
00:13:46,615 --> 00:13:49,414
the topic of the episodes, but, you know,

370
00:13:49,414 --> 00:13:51,115
getting ads, you you do affiliates.

371
00:13:51,929 --> 00:13:54,169
You know, there's nothing wrong with you creating

372
00:13:54,169 --> 00:13:57,149
your own really great ad for an affiliate

373
00:13:57,370 --> 00:13:59,149
program that you're interested in.

374
00:13:59,769 --> 00:14:02,009
You know? That's another way of doing it

375
00:14:02,009 --> 00:14:04,570
without having to deal with, well, this this

376
00:14:04,570 --> 00:14:06,605
copy is not what I want and, you

377
00:14:06,605 --> 00:14:09,565
know, or some, you know, programmatic thing that

378
00:14:09,565 --> 00:14:11,264
may or may not fit your show.

379
00:14:12,044 --> 00:14:12,605
You know, that's

380
00:14:13,404 --> 00:14:15,644
who knows? I I just say, that's another

381
00:14:15,644 --> 00:14:17,245
way of doing it. Let's get back on

382
00:14:17,245 --> 00:14:19,084
track here. In 2025,

383
00:14:19,084 --> 00:14:20,464
it really hasn't been

384
00:14:20,789 --> 00:14:23,750
smooth for everyone. There's been some layoffs in

385
00:14:23,750 --> 00:14:25,209
the industry. Wondery,

386
00:14:25,990 --> 00:14:28,809
which was one of the biggest podcast studios,

387
00:14:29,429 --> 00:14:32,149
had a major restructuring with layoffs. They got

388
00:14:32,149 --> 00:14:33,209
rid of their CEO.

389
00:14:34,754 --> 00:14:37,714
They canceled a bunch of shows, and, yeah,

390
00:14:37,714 --> 00:14:39,254
it was it was ugly.

391
00:14:39,794 --> 00:14:41,495
And, you know We are not immune

392
00:14:43,075 --> 00:14:45,154
to layoffs in this economy. I don't think

393
00:14:45,154 --> 00:14:46,355
anyone is. But

394
00:14:46,834 --> 00:14:49,475
Right. No. Definitely took a hit earlier this

395
00:14:49,475 --> 00:14:51,529
year. Yep. And, you know, but, you know,

396
00:14:51,529 --> 00:14:54,250
some of those big studios, they had staffs

397
00:14:54,250 --> 00:14:55,309
that were unreal.

398
00:14:55,929 --> 00:14:58,009
You know, they put they put a show

399
00:14:58,009 --> 00:15:00,490
together. You know, one show might have a

400
00:15:00,490 --> 00:15:03,230
staff of 50 people or 25 people.

401
00:15:03,929 --> 00:15:04,429
And

402
00:15:04,884 --> 00:15:07,444
can that be sustained in in an economy

403
00:15:07,444 --> 00:15:08,184
like this?

404
00:15:09,365 --> 00:15:10,345
Obviously not.

405
00:15:10,725 --> 00:15:13,225
And, Amazon, which owns Wondery,

406
00:15:14,404 --> 00:15:16,485
finally decided, well, we need to, you know,

407
00:15:16,485 --> 00:15:18,164
we need to cut this off a bit.

408
00:15:18,164 --> 00:15:20,419
And, you know, they they're still existing, and

409
00:15:20,419 --> 00:15:22,659
they still do quality shows and all that,

410
00:15:22,659 --> 00:15:24,819
but, they're doing it with a 110 less

411
00:15:24,819 --> 00:15:25,319
people.

412
00:15:25,699 --> 00:15:27,639
Mhmm. That's that sucks

413
00:15:28,579 --> 00:15:31,139
for them. Yeah. And sucks for everybody, really,

414
00:15:31,139 --> 00:15:32,819
because that was a great studio. It is

415
00:15:32,819 --> 00:15:33,639
a great studio.

416
00:15:34,715 --> 00:15:38,075
But, anyway, one good news thing. For the

417
00:15:38,075 --> 00:15:41,674
first time ever, there's a Golden Globe Award

418
00:15:41,674 --> 00:15:42,975
for best podcast.

419
00:15:44,075 --> 00:15:45,134
So that's interesting.

420
00:15:46,794 --> 00:15:47,294
Yeah.

421
00:15:48,110 --> 00:15:50,029
I I don't know how I feel about

422
00:15:50,029 --> 00:15:50,269
the,

423
00:15:51,309 --> 00:15:52,049
the nominee.

424
00:15:52,909 --> 00:15:54,850
Oh, no. I have no idea.

425
00:15:55,389 --> 00:15:57,009
I am excited to see,

426
00:15:58,669 --> 00:16:00,769
this be added to the Golden Globes.

427
00:16:01,194 --> 00:16:02,954
I don't really it feels like it should

428
00:16:02,954 --> 00:16:03,454
be

429
00:16:05,194 --> 00:16:05,694
the

430
00:16:06,875 --> 00:16:09,355
the Emmys and not the Golden Globes. I'm

431
00:16:09,355 --> 00:16:12,815
not entirely sure. Well, Emmy's for more TV.

432
00:16:13,674 --> 00:16:16,590
Golden Globes is basically is all entertainment, I

433
00:16:16,670 --> 00:16:17,330
think, is

434
00:16:17,790 --> 00:16:19,550
why that happened. But maybe the Emmys will

435
00:16:19,550 --> 00:16:21,870
do it. You never know. Yeah. Yeah. The

436
00:16:21,870 --> 00:16:24,690
Golden Globes are are, film and TV.

437
00:16:24,990 --> 00:16:27,790
Yeah. Well, Netflix is adding podcast, so, you

438
00:16:27,790 --> 00:16:30,850
know, Netflix is, eligible for the Emmy Awards

439
00:16:31,455 --> 00:16:31,934
because they're That's true.

440
00:16:33,215 --> 00:16:35,615
TV. So maybe that'll happen. You know, one

441
00:16:35,615 --> 00:16:37,315
of the shows that they've picked up,

442
00:16:38,575 --> 00:16:40,495
you know, a little further down our list

443
00:16:40,495 --> 00:16:41,134
here, but,

444
00:16:41,774 --> 00:16:44,014
you know, they made some deals, and they're

445
00:16:44,014 --> 00:16:46,274
putting some video podcasts on

446
00:16:46,769 --> 00:16:49,029
Netflix as part of their content. And that's,

447
00:16:49,570 --> 00:16:51,889
you know, that might make it eligible for

448
00:16:51,889 --> 00:16:53,430
the TV type awards.

449
00:16:54,450 --> 00:16:55,750
So interesting.

450
00:16:56,210 --> 00:16:59,009
Well, the Webby's also added podcasts a couple

451
00:16:59,009 --> 00:17:01,009
years ago. I forget how long ago that

452
00:17:01,009 --> 00:17:03,325
was, but, you know, the Webby's used to

453
00:17:03,325 --> 00:17:04,625
just be for web pages.

454
00:17:05,005 --> 00:17:06,144
How boring is that?

455
00:17:07,805 --> 00:17:11,505
The Internet has vastly changed Yes. For sure.

456
00:17:11,644 --> 00:17:14,125
For the worse, for the better. Yep. I

457
00:17:14,125 --> 00:17:16,205
I changed my mind on that throughout the

458
00:17:16,205 --> 00:17:17,825
day every day. Yep.

459
00:17:18,319 --> 00:17:19,839
Now when you go to a website smart

460
00:17:19,839 --> 00:17:21,599
to do. Yeah. You go to a website

461
00:17:21,599 --> 00:17:23,119
and a pop up gets in your face

462
00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:25,460
before you can even look at the website,

463
00:17:25,519 --> 00:17:27,619
you're like, oh, okay. The web web sucks.

464
00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:29,920
And then later on, you read something, oh,

465
00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:31,779
that's really good. You know?

466
00:17:32,284 --> 00:17:33,184
I get it.

467
00:17:33,964 --> 00:17:34,784
Oh, yeah.

468
00:17:36,044 --> 00:17:38,865
What else we got going for 2025?

469
00:17:40,765 --> 00:17:43,644
What did they do? Spotify really is is

470
00:17:43,644 --> 00:17:46,065
just putting more money and effort into podcasting

471
00:17:46,204 --> 00:17:47,339
from what I can tell.

472
00:17:48,059 --> 00:17:49,679
They are do they added

473
00:17:49,980 --> 00:17:53,099
a podcast discovery feature Mhmm. So that, you

474
00:17:53,099 --> 00:17:55,819
know, shows can actually be found better within

475
00:17:55,819 --> 00:17:56,319
Spotify.

476
00:17:57,419 --> 00:17:59,740
So I don't listen to shows in Spotify.

477
00:17:59,740 --> 00:18:02,559
I listen to or I use Spotify for

478
00:18:03,224 --> 00:18:05,545
music and some audio books every once in

479
00:18:05,545 --> 00:18:07,884
a while, but I I mean,

480
00:18:08,505 --> 00:18:10,345
as someone who doesn't listen to podcasts on

481
00:18:10,345 --> 00:18:10,845
Spotify,

482
00:18:11,304 --> 00:18:12,285
I have noticed

483
00:18:12,664 --> 00:18:15,724
the podcasts. They've made it, you know, impossible

484
00:18:15,785 --> 00:18:16,765
to not see.

485
00:18:17,259 --> 00:18:18,779
Yep. I get those. And, you know, I

486
00:18:18,779 --> 00:18:20,940
actually just I have to say, I discovered

487
00:18:20,940 --> 00:18:22,079
a show that I like

488
00:18:22,779 --> 00:18:25,099
that way. And I'm not a boss you

489
00:18:25,099 --> 00:18:26,859
to say? It does. Same on you. Bad

490
00:18:26,859 --> 00:18:30,140
because I hate Spotify for podcasting, but, you

491
00:18:30,140 --> 00:18:31,605
know, and you guys know that.

492
00:18:32,404 --> 00:18:34,565
Yeah. But I found a show, and I'm

493
00:18:34,565 --> 00:18:36,724
like, oh, wow. Really? Cool. And and I

494
00:18:36,724 --> 00:18:37,224
went

495
00:18:37,525 --> 00:18:39,704
to my podcast app of choice

496
00:18:40,804 --> 00:18:43,684
and subscribed to it. I did not listen

497
00:18:43,684 --> 00:18:44,744
to it in Spotify.

498
00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:47,599
That I have done that as well. I

499
00:18:47,599 --> 00:18:49,920
have noticed a show or, like, saw that,

500
00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:50,500
you know,

501
00:18:50,799 --> 00:18:52,319
so and so was a guest on some

502
00:18:52,319 --> 00:18:53,680
episode, and I was like, oh, okay. I

503
00:18:53,680 --> 00:18:56,480
gotta go listen to this Yep. In Apple

504
00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:58,400
Podcast. And I go to I go to

505
00:18:58,400 --> 00:19:00,819
Overcast. That's still my daily driver.

506
00:19:01,414 --> 00:19:03,595
But Yeah. I I do something similar

507
00:19:03,974 --> 00:19:06,454
because I don't use Spotify. I'm all in

508
00:19:06,454 --> 00:19:08,694
on YouTube right now. Mhmm. And so if

509
00:19:08,694 --> 00:19:11,335
I'm listening to YouTube music, they also have

510
00:19:11,335 --> 00:19:13,494
a podcast section in there. Mhmm. And I

511
00:19:13,494 --> 00:19:14,954
kinda do that same thing.

512
00:19:15,289 --> 00:19:17,369
They're they're more based off of what I've

513
00:19:17,369 --> 00:19:19,769
watched on YouTube than what I've listened to.

514
00:19:19,769 --> 00:19:20,589
Mhmm. But,

515
00:19:21,049 --> 00:19:24,970
yeah, my my actual podcast app, which is

516
00:19:24,970 --> 00:19:25,869
currently overcast,

517
00:19:27,142 --> 00:19:29,714
it's I've probably added 15 new podcasts that

518
00:19:29,714 --> 00:19:31,014
I have a hard time getting

519
00:19:32,034 --> 00:19:32,534
completed

520
00:19:32,914 --> 00:19:34,375
every single week or whatever.

521
00:19:35,315 --> 00:19:37,474
So Well, I have an unfair advantage in

522
00:19:37,474 --> 00:19:39,154
that way. I spend too much time on

523
00:19:39,154 --> 00:19:41,394
the tractor this time of year, so I

524
00:19:41,394 --> 00:19:42,375
listen to podcasts.

525
00:19:43,130 --> 00:19:44,970
So I actually ran out of podcasts the

526
00:19:44,970 --> 00:19:45,630
other day,

527
00:19:45,930 --> 00:19:48,029
which is Yeah. That's true. I have

528
00:19:48,570 --> 00:19:51,070
I have, you know, a driver too

529
00:19:51,450 --> 00:19:54,350
around the holidays that I'll probably get some

530
00:19:54,570 --> 00:19:55,549
get some episodes

531
00:19:55,930 --> 00:19:58,269
out of my queue on my phone. So

532
00:19:59,315 --> 00:20:01,894
Yep. So, Apple came out with their,

533
00:20:02,434 --> 00:20:02,934
top

534
00:20:03,634 --> 00:20:05,714
or top shows. I don't know what they

535
00:20:05,714 --> 00:20:08,615
call it. Top new shows, top charts.

536
00:20:09,474 --> 00:20:11,875
And Yeah. If I can find that. There

537
00:20:11,875 --> 00:20:12,535
it is.

538
00:20:12,890 --> 00:20:15,130
And, of course, the usual suspects show up

539
00:20:15,130 --> 00:20:15,870
in the list,

540
00:20:16,410 --> 00:20:19,610
the Joe Rogan, The Daily, Mel Robbins, Crime

541
00:20:19,610 --> 00:20:22,430
Junkie, Dateline. My wife is addicted to Dateline.

542
00:20:24,009 --> 00:20:26,090
Smartless. Hey. You know, I have never listened

543
00:20:26,090 --> 00:20:27,630
to that. I heard it's pretty good.

544
00:20:28,724 --> 00:20:30,105
Call Her Daddy. Guest.

545
00:20:30,484 --> 00:20:32,445
Yeah. It depends on the guest. I that's

546
00:20:32,565 --> 00:20:34,265
isn't that Jason Bateman?

547
00:20:35,204 --> 00:20:36,105
Jason Bateman.

548
00:20:36,484 --> 00:20:36,984
Yeah.

549
00:20:37,765 --> 00:20:41,099
Sean something and, Will Arnett. Yeah. Yeah. And

550
00:20:41,099 --> 00:20:43,440
Call Her Daddy, never listened to that one.

551
00:20:44,059 --> 00:20:45,980
This American Life, I used to listen to

552
00:20:45,980 --> 00:20:47,759
that one a lot, and I just haven't.

553
00:20:48,299 --> 00:20:50,880
And then Huberman's Lab was number nine

554
00:20:52,539 --> 00:20:54,559
and Ezra Klein Show?

555
00:20:55,099 --> 00:20:56,240
Never heard of it.

556
00:20:56,595 --> 00:20:59,154
Okay. And then, top new shows. Of course,

557
00:20:59,154 --> 00:21:01,954
Amy Poehler's got one called Good Hang. That's

558
00:21:01,954 --> 00:21:05,394
been pretty popular, actually. That yeah. She's kind

559
00:21:05,394 --> 00:21:06,835
of a knocking it out of the park.

560
00:21:06,835 --> 00:21:08,855
I mean, I am an Amy Poehler fan,

561
00:21:08,994 --> 00:21:11,359
but I've listened to a couple episodes, and

562
00:21:11,359 --> 00:21:13,599
she's she's doing a good job of, like,

563
00:21:13,599 --> 00:21:15,599
actually being a host. She's not just a

564
00:21:15,599 --> 00:21:18,480
celebrity, like, talking to a you know? Yeah.

565
00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:21,039
That that happens. That's good. I I remember

566
00:21:21,039 --> 00:21:23,299
when podcast one used to be recruiting,

567
00:21:24,884 --> 00:21:25,365
you know, just they'd recruit any celebrity to

568
00:21:25,365 --> 00:21:26,804
do a podcast, and some of them were

569
00:21:26,804 --> 00:21:30,005
terrible at it. Yeah. And I, you know,

570
00:21:30,005 --> 00:21:31,944
I'm I'm a fan of Pawn Stars,

571
00:21:32,244 --> 00:21:34,984
you know, that TV show. And Rick Harrison,

572
00:21:35,044 --> 00:21:36,724
the guy that runs that show, they they

573
00:21:36,724 --> 00:21:38,244
did a podcast when he made it eight

574
00:21:38,244 --> 00:21:38,744
episodes.

575
00:21:39,830 --> 00:21:40,809
It was terrible.

576
00:21:41,670 --> 00:21:44,549
And now they're doing a podcast slash YouTube

577
00:21:44,549 --> 00:21:47,769
channel that's pretty cool called Pawn After Dark.

578
00:21:48,309 --> 00:21:49,769
So his format

579
00:21:50,070 --> 00:21:52,250
that they were doing for that audio show

580
00:21:52,390 --> 00:21:53,049
was terrible.

581
00:21:53,494 --> 00:21:55,414
But now that he's doing it on video

582
00:21:55,414 --> 00:21:57,414
and he's got a cohost and it's really

583
00:21:57,414 --> 00:21:57,914
cool,

584
00:21:58,295 --> 00:22:00,775
you know, that's, you know, that now he's

585
00:22:00,775 --> 00:22:03,275
into podcasting and it actually works

586
00:22:04,055 --> 00:22:06,215
where, you know, not always. But, yeah, here

587
00:22:06,375 --> 00:22:08,295
we'll have the link to this whole list.

588
00:22:08,295 --> 00:22:11,250
There's, you know, top episodes, most shared shows,

589
00:22:11,869 --> 00:22:13,009
most shared episodes,

590
00:22:13,549 --> 00:22:15,710
most followed shows, and so on and so

591
00:22:15,710 --> 00:22:17,950
on. We'll have links in the show notes

592
00:22:17,950 --> 00:22:20,369
to Apple's top chart list.

593
00:22:21,805 --> 00:22:24,045
Yeah. To be honest, the top charts or

594
00:22:24,045 --> 00:22:25,904
the top shows, like, the top 10

595
00:22:26,205 --> 00:22:27,664
of 2025,

596
00:22:28,045 --> 00:22:29,484
a lot of these have already been in

597
00:22:29,484 --> 00:22:30,144
this list.

598
00:22:30,924 --> 00:22:31,904
Year after year.

599
00:22:32,285 --> 00:22:33,424
Yeah. I

600
00:22:35,299 --> 00:22:35,799
people.

601
00:22:36,339 --> 00:22:39,220
Yep. There are so many podcasts out there.

602
00:22:39,220 --> 00:22:41,220
You could listen to a lot more than

603
00:22:41,220 --> 00:22:42,359
just this. Stop.

604
00:22:42,660 --> 00:22:44,259
Well, yeah. Well, you know, the thing is

605
00:22:44,259 --> 00:22:46,279
is those are like the gateway drugs.

606
00:22:46,660 --> 00:22:49,585
Okay. Somebody says, oh, I really like this

607
00:22:49,585 --> 00:22:50,085
show,

608
00:22:50,784 --> 00:22:52,784
and I'm gonna listen to the podcast. Like,

609
00:22:52,784 --> 00:22:54,544
my wife, for instance, likes that,

610
00:22:55,024 --> 00:22:57,585
Dateline show. She likes liked it on TV.

611
00:22:57,585 --> 00:22:59,764
She'll you know, she likes it on podcast.

612
00:23:00,065 --> 00:23:03,444
But then she discovers other true crime podcasts.

613
00:23:03,779 --> 00:23:05,700
And now when we get in the car,

614
00:23:05,700 --> 00:23:08,019
she's wanting to listen to podcasts, not to

615
00:23:08,019 --> 00:23:10,740
radio, which is awesome. So we're we're we're

616
00:23:10,740 --> 00:23:11,240
we're

617
00:23:11,859 --> 00:23:14,980
in onboarding new podcast listeners with these big

618
00:23:14,980 --> 00:23:15,480
shows.

619
00:23:15,940 --> 00:23:17,960
So that that's actually really good.

620
00:23:19,105 --> 00:23:20,704
It's a good way to think about that.

621
00:23:20,704 --> 00:23:22,304
You know? And and same thing with, you

622
00:23:22,304 --> 00:23:23,044
know, all

623
00:23:23,345 --> 00:23:25,345
these minor apps, I call them, you know,

624
00:23:25,345 --> 00:23:26,404
as far as distribution.

625
00:23:27,024 --> 00:23:28,964
Yeah. You know? Get in Spotify.

626
00:23:29,345 --> 00:23:31,904
Even if you don't listen to Spotify as,

627
00:23:31,904 --> 00:23:32,484
you know,

628
00:23:32,865 --> 00:23:33,365
yourself,

629
00:23:33,919 --> 00:23:35,919
people will find you there. Some will listen

630
00:23:35,919 --> 00:23:38,480
there, and some will Mhmm. Find you and

631
00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:40,819
go elsewhere. Same thing with, you know, YouTube

632
00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:42,980
music, with all the places.

633
00:23:43,679 --> 00:23:45,679
Somebody might find you there and then go

634
00:23:45,679 --> 00:23:48,159
to their regular podcast app and and,

635
00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:50,884
sign up and listen to your show or

636
00:23:50,884 --> 00:23:52,585
or just go over there and listen, whatever.

637
00:23:54,244 --> 00:23:55,224
So but,

638
00:23:55,924 --> 00:23:58,164
you know what all this means for us

639
00:23:58,164 --> 00:24:01,224
indie creators? I consider myself one.

640
00:24:02,085 --> 00:24:02,984
You know, visibility

641
00:24:03,365 --> 00:24:04,505
is more important

642
00:24:05,269 --> 00:24:07,929
than it used to be, you know, and,

643
00:24:07,990 --> 00:24:08,889
again, another

644
00:24:09,589 --> 00:24:10,730
plus for video.

645
00:24:11,109 --> 00:24:13,109
You know, you get on YouTube, you know,

646
00:24:13,109 --> 00:24:15,529
even if it's just a short clip or,

647
00:24:16,470 --> 00:24:17,130
you know,

648
00:24:17,509 --> 00:24:19,609
a one off video once in a while,

649
00:24:19,954 --> 00:24:21,734
that'll help people discover you.

650
00:24:23,555 --> 00:24:25,954
But yeah. And, I mean, as for the

651
00:24:25,954 --> 00:24:26,454
discoverability

652
00:24:26,755 --> 00:24:28,934
and, like, the video portion of it,

653
00:24:29,954 --> 00:24:30,775
I mean, there's

654
00:24:31,234 --> 00:24:33,174
there's a popular podcast that

655
00:24:34,029 --> 00:24:36,529
the video component of it shows up on

656
00:24:36,670 --> 00:24:39,410
my TikTok algorithm all the time. Yeah.

657
00:24:39,950 --> 00:24:41,089
So I get that.

658
00:24:41,390 --> 00:24:43,390
I don't actually listen to the show because

659
00:24:43,390 --> 00:24:44,750
it's way too long, and I just don't

660
00:24:44,750 --> 00:24:45,250
care.

661
00:24:46,109 --> 00:24:47,490
Do you like the However

662
00:24:48,375 --> 00:24:50,695
however, they did get my money when they

663
00:24:50,695 --> 00:24:52,855
went on tour and came to Columbus. Like,

664
00:24:52,855 --> 00:24:54,454
I went to that a couple months ago,

665
00:24:54,454 --> 00:24:56,315
so they still got my money somehow.

666
00:24:56,695 --> 00:24:59,255
Yeah. But, you know, even the you know,

667
00:24:59,255 --> 00:24:59,914
like shorts

668
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:02,579
or clips or TikToks or,

669
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:05,380
you know, all the different short video formats,

670
00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:08,079
I I follow a lot of people that

671
00:25:08,079 --> 00:25:10,079
way just for the shorts. And, you know,

672
00:25:10,079 --> 00:25:11,359
and I won't you know, I'm not gonna

673
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:13,140
listen to their hour and a half show,

674
00:25:13,355 --> 00:25:15,375
but I'll listen to their thirty to thirty

675
00:25:15,914 --> 00:25:18,634
second to two minute little shorts here and

676
00:25:18,634 --> 00:25:20,315
there, and I and I follow them quite

677
00:25:20,315 --> 00:25:21,615
closely that way. But,

678
00:25:21,914 --> 00:25:22,494
you know,

679
00:25:23,195 --> 00:25:24,955
I guess the what we're trying to say

680
00:25:24,955 --> 00:25:27,674
for for, you know, indie podcasters is, you

681
00:25:27,674 --> 00:25:28,654
know, be flexible.

682
00:25:29,890 --> 00:25:30,470
You know,

683
00:25:30,930 --> 00:25:32,390
you know, test out stuff.

684
00:25:33,730 --> 00:25:35,170
You know, Dave and I talked about that

685
00:25:35,170 --> 00:25:37,089
last week, you know, testing out formats. Well,

686
00:25:37,089 --> 00:25:38,769
you could also test out, you know, adding

687
00:25:38,769 --> 00:25:40,869
video, adding shorts, adding clips,

688
00:25:41,775 --> 00:25:42,494
You know? Or

689
00:25:43,375 --> 00:25:45,615
It's it's not hard to, like, literally just

690
00:25:45,615 --> 00:25:46,755
buy, like, a little

691
00:25:47,455 --> 00:25:50,035
stand for your phone and just record yourself

692
00:25:50,894 --> 00:25:52,515
recording your episode

693
00:25:52,894 --> 00:25:54,115
and then clip that

694
00:25:54,470 --> 00:25:56,710
and throw that on social because there are

695
00:25:56,710 --> 00:25:58,630
a lot of people out there that they

696
00:25:58,630 --> 00:26:00,809
they could see that thirty second clip

697
00:26:01,190 --> 00:26:03,029
and go, oh, this is interesting. I wanna

698
00:26:03,029 --> 00:26:05,029
know more. Then they follow you. They start

699
00:26:05,029 --> 00:26:05,529
listening.

700
00:26:06,230 --> 00:26:08,490
It's it's something I've been talking about

701
00:26:08,789 --> 00:26:12,115
with podcasters that I'm working with, whether it's,

702
00:26:12,115 --> 00:26:14,534
you know, answering tickets or on the phones

703
00:26:14,595 --> 00:26:17,014
or just podcasters actually know

704
00:26:17,315 --> 00:26:19,714
in my life. I'm like, mhmm. This might

705
00:26:19,714 --> 00:26:22,595
be something worth doing, and it's it's low

706
00:26:22,595 --> 00:26:25,690
effort, so play around with it. Yep. For

707
00:26:25,690 --> 00:26:26,190
sure.

708
00:26:27,210 --> 00:26:28,509
And, you

709
00:26:28,889 --> 00:26:30,269
know, talking about monetization,

710
00:26:30,730 --> 00:26:31,309
you know,

711
00:26:32,089 --> 00:26:34,029
ads are not the only way to monetize

712
00:26:34,089 --> 00:26:34,750
a show.

713
00:26:35,130 --> 00:26:38,009
So Nope. Be, you know, be flexible in

714
00:26:38,009 --> 00:26:39,544
that. You know, you could do,

715
00:26:40,005 --> 00:26:42,644
like, we've mentioned before, you know, Patreon, buy

716
00:26:42,644 --> 00:26:43,544
me a coffee,

717
00:26:43,924 --> 00:26:46,424
PayPal donate links, bag, whatever,

718
00:26:46,884 --> 00:26:48,424
and, you know, you can,

719
00:26:48,884 --> 00:26:50,825
you know, make a little money that way.

720
00:26:51,044 --> 00:26:53,365
It's not just all about ads. You know,

721
00:26:53,365 --> 00:26:54,829
there there are ads

722
00:26:55,369 --> 00:26:56,429
available, but

723
00:26:56,809 --> 00:26:58,650
that might not be right for your show

724
00:26:58,650 --> 00:26:59,630
or your audience.

725
00:27:00,329 --> 00:27:01,230
I do understand

726
00:27:01,849 --> 00:27:03,769
people wanting to do video because they know

727
00:27:03,769 --> 00:27:05,769
they could make money off of YouTube and

728
00:27:05,769 --> 00:27:06,829
TikTok and Instagram.

729
00:27:07,714 --> 00:27:11,075
If they, get enough audience. That's that's the

730
00:27:11,075 --> 00:27:13,894
thing. The threshold for making money on YouTube

731
00:27:13,955 --> 00:27:15,095
is rather high.

732
00:27:15,955 --> 00:27:18,934
Yes. And I believe it's 10,000 followers on

733
00:27:19,234 --> 00:27:20,355
TikTok before you,

734
00:27:21,049 --> 00:27:23,210
before you make anything. And, also, I think

735
00:27:23,210 --> 00:27:23,950
only in

736
00:27:24,250 --> 00:27:24,990
The US

737
00:27:25,609 --> 00:27:27,929
or I don't know. That gets complicated. I

738
00:27:27,929 --> 00:27:30,829
know Canada. It's that way. Yeah. That's all,

739
00:27:31,210 --> 00:27:33,609
all changed here lately too because the ownership

740
00:27:33,609 --> 00:27:36,109
of TikTok has kinda been thrown around.

741
00:27:36,704 --> 00:27:40,325
Correct. As of yesterday, the eighteenth, they said

742
00:27:40,704 --> 00:27:41,605
they're gonna sell

743
00:27:42,304 --> 00:27:42,964
to some

744
00:27:43,345 --> 00:27:45,924
US investors, so we'll see how that goes.

745
00:27:46,065 --> 00:27:48,644
Yep. So Where that happens? Interesting to watch.

746
00:27:48,865 --> 00:27:50,484
That's something to watch next year.

747
00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:54,279
Yeah. Yeah. That was also the 2025

748
00:27:54,279 --> 00:27:56,120
in January. That was a big decision. So

749
00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:57,580
Sure. Yeah. Who knows?

750
00:27:58,200 --> 00:28:00,200
Yep. But be flexible because you never know

751
00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:02,059
what's gonna happen to these big companies,

752
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:04,619
and they might change things on a dime.

753
00:28:04,839 --> 00:28:05,740
And and

754
00:28:06,234 --> 00:28:07,914
your money could be you know, the way

755
00:28:07,914 --> 00:28:09,774
that you're getting money could just be gone.

756
00:28:09,835 --> 00:28:11,835
Yeah. Well, I've I've run into a couple

757
00:28:11,835 --> 00:28:12,414
of YouTubers

758
00:28:12,714 --> 00:28:15,615
that, have come to us to start podcasting,

759
00:28:16,794 --> 00:28:18,575
and they got demonetized

760
00:28:19,159 --> 00:28:22,759
by YouTube for whatever reason, and their entire

761
00:28:22,759 --> 00:28:23,819
income went poof.

762
00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:26,619
Yeah. And if you build it yourself,

763
00:28:27,079 --> 00:28:28,059
own it yourself,

764
00:28:28,679 --> 00:28:29,500
and diversify

765
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:32,519
how you're making money on it, maybe one

766
00:28:32,519 --> 00:28:33,500
will fall out,

767
00:28:33,934 --> 00:28:36,275
but you'll have others to back it up.

768
00:28:36,974 --> 00:28:39,214
So that's a good thing. And, of course,

769
00:28:39,214 --> 00:28:41,474
as we always say, quality and consistency

770
00:28:42,015 --> 00:28:43,474
are still big winners.

771
00:28:44,015 --> 00:28:45,054
You know, just,

772
00:28:45,535 --> 00:28:47,855
you know, be consistent, do what you're good

773
00:28:47,855 --> 00:28:48,355
at,

774
00:28:49,109 --> 00:28:50,250
and, you know, offer

775
00:28:50,630 --> 00:28:51,529
good content,

776
00:28:52,309 --> 00:28:55,529
decent audio or video or whatever you're, into.

777
00:28:56,150 --> 00:28:57,990
And, you know, that that will win the

778
00:28:57,990 --> 00:29:00,009
day. You know? Just keep plugging away.

779
00:29:00,549 --> 00:29:02,630
Yeah. Because you only get better as you

780
00:29:02,630 --> 00:29:04,755
keep doing something. I I think I say

781
00:29:04,755 --> 00:29:05,974
it to

782
00:29:06,275 --> 00:29:08,515
Mike and Mackenzie after we record an episode.

783
00:29:08,515 --> 00:29:10,355
I was like, man, I am so rusty.

784
00:29:10,355 --> 00:29:13,255
I haven't actually made a podcast regularly

785
00:29:13,875 --> 00:29:14,615
in ages.

786
00:29:14,994 --> 00:29:15,394
So

787
00:29:15,875 --> 00:29:18,295
Yeah. You know threw you another wolf.

788
00:29:18,914 --> 00:29:19,980
Yeah. I know. Right?

789
00:29:20,619 --> 00:29:22,220
But, yeah, like, you just get better the

790
00:29:22,220 --> 00:29:23,980
more you do it. So, like, figure out

791
00:29:23,980 --> 00:29:25,919
a schedule that works for you and

792
00:29:27,900 --> 00:29:30,319
tweak things as you go. Like, it you're

793
00:29:31,500 --> 00:29:33,835
I think sometimes and this is a little

794
00:29:33,835 --> 00:29:35,755
rant of mine. But sometimes I think we

795
00:29:35,755 --> 00:29:38,714
look at these highly produced podcasts, like the

796
00:29:38,714 --> 00:29:40,075
ones that are sitting at the top of

797
00:29:40,075 --> 00:29:41,934
the Apple charts right now or whatever,

798
00:29:42,315 --> 00:29:44,734
and we're like, that's what we wanna do.

799
00:29:44,839 --> 00:29:46,680
And it's like, yes. But how many people

800
00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:48,680
are working on that show and engineering the

801
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,720
sound or video or whatever? And just at

802
00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:54,359
some point, you may get there. Just keep

803
00:29:54,359 --> 00:29:54,859
going.

804
00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:57,160
Yeah. And, you know, there's no reason an

805
00:29:57,160 --> 00:29:59,085
indie can't do a lot of that themselves,

806
00:29:59,085 --> 00:30:01,105
but how much time do you wanna spend?

807
00:30:01,644 --> 00:30:03,724
That's that's part of the problem, you know,

808
00:30:03,724 --> 00:30:05,565
with with people who get a regular day

809
00:30:05,565 --> 00:30:07,005
job and they, you know, they got all

810
00:30:07,005 --> 00:30:08,684
all the other things going on in life.

811
00:30:08,684 --> 00:30:10,525
They don't have time to spend four hours

812
00:30:10,525 --> 00:30:12,304
editing a podcast episode.

813
00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:15,240
Yeah. And It can be a grind for

814
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:17,720
sure. Yeah. I mean, you know, I'm I've

815
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:19,799
I've been editing for the last couple of

816
00:30:19,799 --> 00:30:20,299
weeks,

817
00:30:21,079 --> 00:30:22,299
for this show,

818
00:30:22,599 --> 00:30:25,160
you know, because Kate's, taking a much deserved

819
00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:25,660
vacation.

820
00:30:26,519 --> 00:30:27,019
And,

821
00:30:27,724 --> 00:30:29,884
you know, I I'm rusty at it, I'll

822
00:30:29,884 --> 00:30:30,545
tell you.

823
00:30:31,644 --> 00:30:33,404
But, you know, I got one cranked out

824
00:30:33,404 --> 00:30:35,105
today, so we're good.

825
00:30:35,484 --> 00:30:37,505
It's definitely a skill you have to exercise.

826
00:30:37,805 --> 00:30:40,545
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And speaking of,

827
00:30:40,990 --> 00:30:42,829
the go ahead. No. I was just gonna

828
00:30:42,829 --> 00:30:44,909
say I you know, on my personal shows,

829
00:30:44,909 --> 00:30:47,390
it's very rare that I edit anything. It's

830
00:30:47,390 --> 00:30:49,009
basically clip the ends,

831
00:30:49,710 --> 00:30:50,450
be done.

832
00:30:51,390 --> 00:30:54,450
Yeah. And speaking of taking forever to edit,

833
00:30:56,134 --> 00:30:58,934
we are we're seeing, you know, a lot

834
00:30:58,934 --> 00:30:59,595
of recognition

835
00:30:59,974 --> 00:31:00,474
for

836
00:31:01,014 --> 00:31:02,154
long form storytellers.

837
00:31:03,414 --> 00:31:05,595
And this is exciting to me being a,

838
00:31:06,294 --> 00:31:08,855
you know, D and D slash tabletop role

839
00:31:08,855 --> 00:31:09,355
playing

840
00:31:09,900 --> 00:31:11,119
podcaster myself.

841
00:31:12,380 --> 00:31:13,900
You know, we talked about the award shows

842
00:31:13,900 --> 00:31:14,640
at the beginning

843
00:31:15,180 --> 00:31:16,720
toward the beginning of the episode.

844
00:31:17,740 --> 00:31:19,359
And I think it's cool to see

845
00:31:20,460 --> 00:31:22,320
those kind of shows get more

846
00:31:22,779 --> 00:31:23,279
recognition.

847
00:31:24,825 --> 00:31:26,744
There are a couple shows in my mind

848
00:31:26,744 --> 00:31:28,184
that I'm like, I can't wait to see

849
00:31:28,184 --> 00:31:31,144
those shows hit the top charts because they're

850
00:31:31,144 --> 00:31:32,984
so good. Whether you like D and D

851
00:31:32,984 --> 00:31:34,684
or not, just the storytelling

852
00:31:35,304 --> 00:31:35,804
is

853
00:31:36,265 --> 00:31:37,404
really, really cool.

854
00:31:40,090 --> 00:31:41,150
Oh, very good.

855
00:31:41,610 --> 00:31:44,430
I got a a some personal stuff here

856
00:31:44,490 --> 00:31:46,590
that happened in 2025.

857
00:31:47,369 --> 00:31:49,529
As as, of course, I'm sure you know,

858
00:31:49,529 --> 00:31:51,549
we lost our founder, CEO,

859
00:31:51,850 --> 00:31:54,410
good friend, and a cohost on this show,

860
00:31:54,410 --> 00:31:57,085
Todd Cochran, this year, and it was a

861
00:31:57,085 --> 00:31:57,585
significant

862
00:31:58,605 --> 00:32:00,625
setback for us here at Blueberry

863
00:32:01,484 --> 00:32:03,984
and for the whole podcasting industry, frankly.

864
00:32:04,845 --> 00:32:06,605
And the good news is we have a

865
00:32:06,605 --> 00:32:08,545
very deep team here. We're,

866
00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:11,759
you know, we're pressing on with Todd's vision

867
00:32:11,759 --> 00:32:13,220
and some of our own,

868
00:32:13,839 --> 00:32:14,339
and,

869
00:32:15,039 --> 00:32:17,200
you know, just wanted to acknowledge that for

870
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:18,880
this last show of the year. You know,

871
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:20,259
Blueberry's here to stay,

872
00:32:21,055 --> 00:32:24,015
and our commitment to podcast creators and the

873
00:32:24,015 --> 00:32:25,474
open nature of podcasting

874
00:32:26,015 --> 00:32:28,434
is still here and still intact.

875
00:32:29,055 --> 00:32:29,375
So,

876
00:32:30,095 --> 00:32:32,434
we look forward to 2026.

877
00:32:33,929 --> 00:32:36,730
And, of course, 2025 has shown podcasting is

878
00:32:36,730 --> 00:32:38,990
still mostly audio. That's my opinion.

879
00:32:39,769 --> 00:32:41,549
Video is getting more popular

880
00:32:41,929 --> 00:32:42,909
with some audience.

881
00:32:43,529 --> 00:32:45,470
Podcasting nowadays is about flexibility,

882
00:32:45,849 --> 00:32:49,149
formats, and adapting to what listeners actually want.

883
00:32:49,184 --> 00:32:50,865
And get to know your listeners. That's, I

884
00:32:50,865 --> 00:32:53,125
guess, the key takeaway, I would say.

885
00:32:54,705 --> 00:32:55,845
And we're seeing platforms

886
00:32:56,305 --> 00:32:58,325
change and evolve, so

887
00:32:58,945 --> 00:33:01,025
every single one of us creators has to

888
00:33:01,025 --> 00:33:01,924
stay nimble.

889
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:04,160
But at the end of the day, remember

890
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:06,420
that good content is still gonna win out,

891
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:09,119
and, it doesn't matter if you're doing audio

892
00:33:09,119 --> 00:33:09,859
or video.

893
00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:13,380
Okay. Before we get out of here,

894
00:33:13,759 --> 00:33:14,960
I have to put you guys on the

895
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:17,434
spot. Okay. I don't know. What was your

896
00:33:17,434 --> 00:33:19,375
favorite show of 2025?

897
00:33:21,515 --> 00:33:22,894
My favorite show.

898
00:33:25,195 --> 00:33:28,335
Probably something you've never heard of, but, Midlife

899
00:33:28,474 --> 00:33:29,454
Pilot Podcast.

900
00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:32,900
That's the one that's like an indie show?

901
00:33:33,039 --> 00:33:35,920
Yeah. I, I found them on Spotify and

902
00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:38,960
then promptly went to Overcast and subscribed, and,

903
00:33:39,119 --> 00:33:40,660
so far, I'm loving the show.

904
00:33:42,174 --> 00:33:44,575
Yeah. I think my favorite show from this

905
00:33:44,575 --> 00:33:45,075
year,

906
00:33:46,095 --> 00:33:48,755
is called Worlds Beyond Number. It is

907
00:33:50,494 --> 00:33:51,634
Dungeons and Dragons

908
00:33:52,414 --> 00:33:54,355
tabletop role playing game podcast.

909
00:33:55,295 --> 00:33:56,515
Just great,

910
00:33:56,970 --> 00:33:58,109
great voice acting

911
00:33:58,569 --> 00:33:59,069
and

912
00:33:59,450 --> 00:33:59,950
imagination

913
00:34:00,329 --> 00:34:01,470
happening on that show.

914
00:34:03,130 --> 00:34:04,669
Yeah. I like it a lot.

915
00:34:04,970 --> 00:34:05,470
Nice.

916
00:34:06,169 --> 00:34:07,390
So what was yours? Mine

917
00:34:07,929 --> 00:34:08,909
yeah. Mine,

918
00:34:10,010 --> 00:34:11,949
has been the same for a couple years,

919
00:34:12,010 --> 00:34:13,414
is Song Exploder.

920
00:34:14,434 --> 00:34:15,574
It's just they

921
00:34:16,594 --> 00:34:17,494
they have

922
00:34:17,795 --> 00:34:20,994
the artist that, you know, who sings the

923
00:34:20,994 --> 00:34:21,494
song,

924
00:34:22,114 --> 00:34:24,934
come on to the episode and go through

925
00:34:25,155 --> 00:34:27,400
how it was made and why they chose

926
00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:29,559
this and, you know, talking about how it

927
00:34:29,559 --> 00:34:31,880
was produced and who wrote it, if they

928
00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:33,880
wrote it, all that type of stuff.

929
00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:37,480
So that one is hard to top for

930
00:34:37,480 --> 00:34:39,820
me. Yeah. That's a solid show.

931
00:34:40,255 --> 00:34:42,414
Yeah. It's been around for I don't know

932
00:34:42,414 --> 00:34:44,094
how long, but I've been listening to it

933
00:34:44,094 --> 00:34:46,414
for a very long time. Almost ten years,

934
00:34:46,414 --> 00:34:49,695
I think. Yeah. It it's definitely close to

935
00:34:49,695 --> 00:34:51,695
that. They've I'll have to go check that

936
00:34:51,695 --> 00:34:52,195
out.

937
00:34:52,579 --> 00:34:55,400
They've had some different hosts over the years,

938
00:34:56,340 --> 00:34:57,880
but it is just, like,

939
00:34:58,260 --> 00:35:00,179
quality episodes, and then they play the song

940
00:35:00,179 --> 00:35:01,239
at the end. So

941
00:35:01,780 --> 00:35:03,539
I would love to listen to, you know,

942
00:35:03,539 --> 00:35:05,159
maybe I'll try and find more

943
00:35:06,155 --> 00:35:09,275
independent shows that do somewhat around the same

944
00:35:09,275 --> 00:35:10,715
thing, but that one would be hard to

945
00:35:10,715 --> 00:35:13,054
do independent because, one, they have the actual

946
00:35:13,514 --> 00:35:14,014
artist,

947
00:35:14,394 --> 00:35:16,255
and, two, they have to pay for

948
00:35:16,875 --> 00:35:19,275
License. To play the song every single episode.

949
00:35:19,275 --> 00:35:20,335
Yeah. So it's

950
00:35:21,260 --> 00:35:23,099
not cheap to do that one, I would

951
00:35:23,099 --> 00:35:23,599
assume.

952
00:35:25,339 --> 00:35:25,839
Overall,

953
00:35:26,859 --> 00:35:29,119
this is the perfect time to experiment

954
00:35:29,500 --> 00:35:32,940
experiment for indie creators that goes for any

955
00:35:32,940 --> 00:35:34,859
medium right now. I think everyone is just

956
00:35:34,859 --> 00:35:36,265
kind of becoming

957
00:35:36,644 --> 00:35:37,465
more open,

958
00:35:38,324 --> 00:35:39,785
and likely to watch

959
00:35:40,565 --> 00:35:41,065
local

960
00:35:41,525 --> 00:35:42,824
indie content,

961
00:35:43,605 --> 00:35:45,224
as opposed to from these

962
00:35:46,085 --> 00:35:48,425
big networks and corporations and everything.

963
00:35:49,285 --> 00:35:49,785
So

964
00:35:50,930 --> 00:35:53,329
this is just a a good 2025

965
00:35:53,329 --> 00:35:53,829
recap.

966
00:35:54,369 --> 00:35:57,170
Yeah. So I guess I'll I'll, wrap it

967
00:35:57,170 --> 00:35:59,010
up here. Happy New Year. We'll see you

968
00:35:59,010 --> 00:36:00,710
in 2026.

969
00:36:03,010 --> 00:36:05,054
Thanks for joining us. Let's meet up next

970
00:36:05,054 --> 00:36:07,234
week. And in the meantime, for more information,

971
00:36:07,454 --> 00:36:10,080
to subscribe, share, or follow, check out the

972
00:36:10,080 --> 00:36:12,740
show notes at podcastinsider.com.

973
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:14,720
To check out our latest suite of services

974
00:36:14,720 --> 00:36:16,560
and how Blueberry can help you leverage your

975
00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:18,400
podcast, visit blueberry.com.

976
00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:20,340
That's Blueberry without the e's.