Experimenting With Your Show Format Without Losing Listeners – PCI 465

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Welcome to Podcast Insider. I'm Mike Dell, vice

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president of customer relations at Blueberry.

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And I'm Dave Clements, technical support and social

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media specialist here at Blueberry.

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Today,

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we're gonna be talking about how to experiment

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with your show format

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without freaking out your audience or yourself.

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You're listening to Podcast Insider, a weekly podcast

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bringing insights, advice, and insider tips and tricks

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to help you start, grow, and thrive through

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podcasting with the support of your team here

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at Blueberry Podcasting. Welcome. Let's dive in.

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Yeah. Freaking out the audience is a thing.

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It's just people you know, now I

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being the king of pod fade, I've tried

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every format and all that, and, you know,

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none of them really stuck. So my, you

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know, my format

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changes a lot on my main show.

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But on my little daily show,

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it's almost

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the same every time.

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And, you know, it's it's always good to

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to mix it up once in a while,

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you know, as long as

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I

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I deal with that a lot too. I've

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been doing this for I think this is

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officially my

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thirteenth year, fourteenth. I don't remember now.

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But I know

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all the different shows that I've I've done.

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I have changed the format

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largely because

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I get bored. I'll do it like that

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for a couple years, and I'm like, nah.

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I gotta switch it up.

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Is that kinda the case with you, or

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is it just

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the show died, you brought it back,

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it died, you brought it back? No. That's

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weird. Yeah. With me, it's, kind of I

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do a show. I do an episode, and

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it's a serious episode. And then, you know,

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the next one, well, I got a different

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topic. It's not so serious,

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and I just change it up. I mean

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but my audience sort of expects that. They

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never they never know what they're gonna get

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when they hit play. And

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but, you know, like,

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Todd was always saying about Geek News Central

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as he would just do one little thing,

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you know, like,

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he used to do a cold open,

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and then he'd play a theme song, And

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then he would go into, you know, his

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personal stuff, and then he would get into

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the meat of the episode. And

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and what he would do is he'd sometimes

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he'd play the theme first for a while

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and then do the cold open and

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or not cold open, just open.

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And, you know, just little tweaks like that.

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He's, you know, changed up the theme song

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and, you know, just that kind of thing.

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And, you know, as long as it's not

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too abrupt and too ridiculous,

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it's not bad, you know? And, you know,

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it there are some people out there that,

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you know, listeners that will be offended that,

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well, you're not doing this anymore. Why? You

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know?

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Yeah.

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Yeah. Yeah.

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I think that that's always that's always what

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I've

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done is little changes.

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You know, my first

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and what I would call my flagship show,

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it was a pop culture podcast,

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and

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I started out where it was just me.

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It was just me behind the microphone,

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and I'd talk about a comic book or

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a movie or something like that. And then

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at some point,

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I made friends

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with a guy who liked all the same

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stuff I did, and I was like, well,

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come in as a cohost.

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And that was a huge change,

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but

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people really responded to it well. Because, apparently,

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I work better in a multi person,

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you know, format

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rather than a solo format. So people have

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always been really happy that it's always me

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and somebody else

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just

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to have that dialogue and and to bounce

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ideas and opinions off each other.

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But I've changed music and

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all kinds of stuff. But, you know, doing

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this for as long as we have, we've

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had a lot of time to experiment.

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Oh, yeah. It's,

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you know, it's it's fun. It keeps you

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excited, you know, when you're changing things up.

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And

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but, you know, you also kinda gotta keep

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it sort of the same at the same

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time. And I know that's weird, but, you

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know, adding a cohost

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to what was formerly a a

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solo show

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can add excitement for you, can,

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you know, help the audience get to know

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somebody else

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and all that. We've switched this, this show's

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format up a couple of times in its,

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history.

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And, you know, but we've done really big,

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abrupt changes, probably not the best way to

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do it. But, hey. We still got you

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listening or whoever is listening. That's good. Right.

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But, you know, we've we've you know, we

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used to cover, you know, current events and

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all that. And, you know, there's enough other

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shows out there doing that, so we decided

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to focus more on helping you,

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you know, with podcasting stuff. That's what a

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podcast

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about podcasting is supposed to do.

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But, you know, we've done minor tweaks to

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our format. You know, you'll notice that we

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don't have as bit much theme music as

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we once did.

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You know, used to do a cold open.

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Sometimes we do. Sometimes we don't. It all

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depends on what Kate's doing,

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our editor, and we leave it up to

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her. She knows what she's doing.

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And,

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you know, we're just talent.

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Well, that's in big air quotes. But,

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anyway,

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but, you know, it's,

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it's a lot of it's a lot of

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fun, you know, changing things up. You know,

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test stuff. Ask your audience about it too.

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Hey. You noticed we started the show a

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little different today. What do you think?

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And, you know, I might get some people

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talking to you.

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Yeah. That was always a big thing that

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I ran into,

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in those earlier days where I was still

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trying to figure it out. And, you know,

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sometimes I would prefer one format over another.

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And so that would end up being my

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call to action at the end of an

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episode, which was, hey. Do you like, you

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know, this segment that I added? Do you

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wish this old segment I took out was

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still here?

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And that would actually prompt feedback,

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because if I didn't hear anything, well, I'm

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just gonna keep doing it until I'm bored

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with it. Mhmm. And I think it's a

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really good way to start to build that

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community,

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And that's a that's a thing that podcasters

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talk about a lot is, well, how do

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I build a community?

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Play around with your show a little bit.

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That's what made my show

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bigger for me.

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And,

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you know, I always got good feedback. Sometimes

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I listened to it. Sometimes I didn't.

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But

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I think the the biggest recommendation I could

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give is

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start

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small

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with, you know, what I would consider tweaks,

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and then

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experiment

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would be your next step. Like, move some

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things around. And then if you have overhauls,

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like adding a cohost

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or removing a cohost or whatever,

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Those

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those big things, like, save those till last

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once you have feedback from your audience.

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Yeah. And, you know, getting feedback, it's amazing

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what one email

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can do

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to, you know, a person that's,

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you know, us doing a solo show, and

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they're not getting much feedback.

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You know? Tweak it a little bit and,

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you know, invite the feedback. That's the that's

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the thing. You know? The listeners will tell

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you if you're doing something really wrong,

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most of the time, either that or they

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just disappear. So if you see your stats

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crash, well, you know, well, that ain't working.

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Right. You know? But, you know, it's it

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it's your show. Do what you like,

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and, you know, keep it exciting for you.

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Keep it exciting for the audience.

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Again, you know, I'm not a very good,

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very good example with my personal show because,

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you know, one time, it's gonna be

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one completely different thing than the the next

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episode. And

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that keeps it interesting for me. And, you

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know, so far, most of my audience kinda

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sticks with me, but I do get some

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feedback from time to time. And it's just

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amazing what, you know, just that one listener

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that says, hey. What about this? Or, you

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know, why don't you try that? You know,

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I had one,

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email me, hey. I I haven't heard you

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talk about this particular subject before, and that's

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a good idea. So I made an episode

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about it.

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Yeah. You know, things

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like that. But, you know, don't,

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you know, don't just go through and just

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change it completely. You know? I'm doing a

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show about dogs, and then next week, you

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come back and do a show about cats.

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Well, no. You know, stay in your genre

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if you've got if you picked a genre.

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You know?

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But,

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you know, you can vary that. Even the

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subject matter change can,

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can can be a a tweak that you

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do. You know? Maybe instead of,

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you know, diving deep every episode, do an

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episode where you're just kinda doing tips and

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tricks or you're answering feedback that you've got.

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He listened to an aviation show that started

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out as a

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solo, and he did probably a 100 episodes

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as as a solo. Then he brought on

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a guest that was one of his listeners

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that was always sending in feedback,

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and he brought them on as a cohost.

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And now he has a rotating cast of

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five or six cohosts, and you never know

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who you're gonna get in that show. But

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it really

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helped him, you know, get, you know, first

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to know other people,

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know his community,

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and it's really, you know, a pretty big

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deal now. You know, they've actually had

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meetups in London or in Atlanta

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or wherever of, you know, the community for

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the around that podcast where they, you know,

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maybe record you know, I think he did,

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episode 500, and he had a big party

270
00:09:49,299 --> 00:09:50,039
in Atlanta.

271
00:09:50,419 --> 00:09:52,179
And, you know, all of his cohosts flew

272
00:09:52,179 --> 00:09:54,740
in from all over the world and and,

273
00:09:54,740 --> 00:09:56,500
you know, plus he had a whole bunch

274
00:09:56,500 --> 00:09:57,000
of,

275
00:09:57,939 --> 00:10:00,039
you know, whole bunch of other listeners there.

276
00:10:00,794 --> 00:10:03,115
And, you know, he really can you know,

277
00:10:03,115 --> 00:10:03,934
did a community,

278
00:10:04,554 --> 00:10:05,774
around his show,

279
00:10:06,315 --> 00:10:08,315
and that was simply by changing up the

280
00:10:08,315 --> 00:10:08,815
format.

281
00:10:10,634 --> 00:10:11,695
That's really interesting.

282
00:10:12,075 --> 00:10:13,995
Yeah. And so and, you know, he's still

283
00:10:13,995 --> 00:10:16,820
at it. He's retired. Our airline pilot now,

284
00:10:16,820 --> 00:10:19,779
and and, so he he he travels around,

285
00:10:19,779 --> 00:10:21,779
and they still talk about aviation, but he

286
00:10:21,779 --> 00:10:24,660
has, you know, I think there's, like, six

287
00:10:24,660 --> 00:10:25,160
rotating

288
00:10:25,860 --> 00:10:28,019
guest hosts. You know? Sometimes they have four

289
00:10:28,019 --> 00:10:29,639
of them on there at the same time.

290
00:10:29,945 --> 00:10:30,445
It's,

291
00:10:30,904 --> 00:10:32,745
but, you know, it's it's always a little

292
00:10:32,745 --> 00:10:35,164
different, but it's always kinda the same.

293
00:10:36,264 --> 00:10:36,904
So Yeah.

294
00:10:38,105 --> 00:10:40,284
Another thing you can think about doing is,

295
00:10:40,904 --> 00:10:41,964
looking at the length

296
00:10:42,345 --> 00:10:43,325
of your episodes.

297
00:10:44,750 --> 00:10:46,129
When I was doing

298
00:10:46,509 --> 00:10:47,730
the D and D podcast,

299
00:10:48,830 --> 00:10:50,050
a couple of years ago,

300
00:10:50,670 --> 00:10:51,889
it started out

301
00:10:53,070 --> 00:10:54,769
as they would do, like

302
00:10:55,149 --> 00:10:56,690
oh, jeez. I think we're

303
00:10:57,115 --> 00:10:58,415
they were looking at, like,

304
00:11:01,274 --> 00:11:03,915
two hour episodes Mhmm. Because they would record

305
00:11:03,915 --> 00:11:05,595
for, like, four, and they would cut them

306
00:11:05,595 --> 00:11:07,615
in half. So those were two hours long,

307
00:11:08,154 --> 00:11:08,654
and,

308
00:11:10,555 --> 00:11:11,215
that was

309
00:11:12,220 --> 00:11:14,720
that was not necessarily manageable for

310
00:11:15,340 --> 00:11:16,240
a lot of listeners.

311
00:11:16,700 --> 00:11:17,200
So

312
00:11:17,820 --> 00:11:19,360
after I got involved,

313
00:11:20,059 --> 00:11:22,059
I recommended, well, what if we do one

314
00:11:22,059 --> 00:11:22,879
hour episodes?

315
00:11:23,514 --> 00:11:25,695
Because first of all, that makes more episodes

316
00:11:25,914 --> 00:11:27,294
for people to listen to.

317
00:11:28,475 --> 00:11:30,394
But also, it makes it easier on your

318
00:11:30,394 --> 00:11:30,894
editor,

319
00:11:31,195 --> 00:11:31,695
and

320
00:11:32,154 --> 00:11:34,475
I think people would pay more attention with

321
00:11:34,475 --> 00:11:35,615
those shorter episodes.

322
00:11:35,995 --> 00:11:37,995
And when we changed to that format, it

323
00:11:37,995 --> 00:11:38,495
allowed

324
00:11:38,909 --> 00:11:40,370
that show to go from

325
00:11:40,750 --> 00:11:42,370
once a month to

326
00:11:42,829 --> 00:11:43,730
once a week.

327
00:11:44,269 --> 00:11:45,329
And I think,

328
00:11:46,829 --> 00:11:49,470
before that kind of took a hiatus, they

329
00:11:49,470 --> 00:11:52,289
were doing, like, once every other week just

330
00:11:52,350 --> 00:11:54,105
for editing purposes. But,

331
00:11:54,664 --> 00:11:57,084
you could consider, like, shortening your episodes,

332
00:11:58,584 --> 00:12:00,664
you know, so that it you could stagger

333
00:12:00,664 --> 00:12:02,424
them out a little bit, or, you know,

334
00:12:02,424 --> 00:12:04,445
maybe you're just cutting off fluff

335
00:12:04,904 --> 00:12:07,485
that people don't really wanna listen to.

336
00:12:07,980 --> 00:12:09,600
That's just an idea.

337
00:12:10,059 --> 00:12:10,700
Yeah. That's,

338
00:12:11,500 --> 00:12:13,340
you know, again and, you know, I mentioned

339
00:12:13,340 --> 00:12:15,820
before, you can alternate between, you know, the

340
00:12:15,820 --> 00:12:18,940
really deep episodes and, you know, some quick

341
00:12:18,940 --> 00:12:20,879
episodes. So, you know, even

342
00:12:21,524 --> 00:12:24,084
within the list of episodes, you could have

343
00:12:24,084 --> 00:12:25,764
one that's an hour long and one that's

344
00:12:25,764 --> 00:12:26,824
ten minutes long,

345
00:12:27,284 --> 00:12:30,345
you know, and, you know, maybe alternate those

346
00:12:30,485 --> 00:12:32,904
or have, you know, special episodes.

347
00:12:33,524 --> 00:12:35,444
You know, there's a there's a way in

348
00:12:35,444 --> 00:12:35,944
most

349
00:12:36,940 --> 00:12:39,740
RSS creation tools to mark something as a

350
00:12:39,740 --> 00:12:42,459
bonus episode. So you feel like doing something

351
00:12:42,459 --> 00:12:44,639
completely different, throw one of those in there.

352
00:12:45,100 --> 00:12:48,320
You know? Yeah. Always fun. You know? No.

353
00:12:49,019 --> 00:12:49,579
You know, I

354
00:12:50,424 --> 00:12:52,424
my my first show, that went from me

355
00:12:52,424 --> 00:12:54,424
to a single co host to there were

356
00:12:54,424 --> 00:12:56,924
a total of four of us, sometimes five.

357
00:12:57,465 --> 00:13:00,345
And I remember a piece of feedback that

358
00:13:00,345 --> 00:13:02,745
really helped me was we I would just,

359
00:13:02,745 --> 00:13:05,225
like, start the recording and leave a lot

360
00:13:05,225 --> 00:13:06,629
of, like, the super casual

361
00:13:07,169 --> 00:13:09,730
conversations on at the beginning. And I would

362
00:13:09,730 --> 00:13:10,389
get feedback

363
00:13:10,769 --> 00:13:12,929
where people are just like, I I'm glad

364
00:13:12,929 --> 00:13:14,850
you guys are having fun, but I don't

365
00:13:14,850 --> 00:13:16,069
like the fact that

366
00:13:16,449 --> 00:13:18,610
all of the guys are surprised that they're

367
00:13:18,610 --> 00:13:20,069
being recorded. And,

368
00:13:20,495 --> 00:13:22,014
like, that makes me feel weird. And I

369
00:13:22,014 --> 00:13:24,414
was like, oh, okay. Well, I guess we'll

370
00:13:24,414 --> 00:13:25,794
just cut that out. And

371
00:13:26,174 --> 00:13:28,434
that actually helped. I saw downloads

372
00:13:29,214 --> 00:13:30,914
go up, believe it or not.

373
00:13:31,294 --> 00:13:33,534
And people just responded much better because they're

374
00:13:33,534 --> 00:13:35,519
like, instead of you guys goofing off, you're

375
00:13:35,519 --> 00:13:38,320
actually, like, getting into the movie to review

376
00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:40,800
that you're doing or or whatever it was

377
00:13:40,800 --> 00:13:42,420
that we were talking about. So

378
00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:45,279
that was that was again, going back to

379
00:13:45,279 --> 00:13:46,019
that feedback,

380
00:13:47,325 --> 00:13:49,164
that my audience was like, no. You've got

381
00:13:49,164 --> 00:13:51,004
to cut this part out because it's not

382
00:13:51,004 --> 00:13:52,924
enjoyable to listen to. Put it at the

383
00:13:52,924 --> 00:13:54,924
end or something. You know? You could always

384
00:13:54,924 --> 00:13:56,605
do that, and they can they can bail

385
00:13:56,605 --> 00:13:58,784
after the the good stuff, I guess.

386
00:13:59,964 --> 00:14:02,529
Yeah. You know, you know, a lot of

387
00:14:02,529 --> 00:14:04,769
lot of podcasters, you know, back in the

388
00:14:04,769 --> 00:14:06,470
day okay. I'm an old guy.

389
00:14:07,090 --> 00:14:09,490
Would, you know, have all the fluff at

390
00:14:09,490 --> 00:14:12,389
the beginning and then get into their topic.

391
00:14:12,610 --> 00:14:13,110
And,

392
00:14:14,584 --> 00:14:16,985
as it went on, they would kinda get

393
00:14:16,985 --> 00:14:18,664
rid of the fluff or put the fluff

394
00:14:18,664 --> 00:14:21,464
at the end or or maybe just not

395
00:14:21,464 --> 00:14:22,125
do it.

396
00:14:23,225 --> 00:14:25,464
Again, it's all about your audience. Some some

397
00:14:25,464 --> 00:14:27,590
of your audience really don't care what the

398
00:14:27,590 --> 00:14:29,769
subject are. They just wanna listen to you.

399
00:14:30,230 --> 00:14:31,669
Believe it or not, there's a lot of

400
00:14:31,669 --> 00:14:33,350
that going around. I mean, I listen to

401
00:14:33,350 --> 00:14:35,190
a show that I really could care less

402
00:14:35,190 --> 00:14:37,029
about the subject matter. I just like the

403
00:14:37,029 --> 00:14:37,529
person.

404
00:14:38,230 --> 00:14:39,669
You know? That's cool. I might be a

405
00:14:39,669 --> 00:14:41,129
little weird about that, but,

406
00:14:41,590 --> 00:14:42,250
you know,

407
00:14:43,004 --> 00:14:45,004
it's it's just, you know, not not something

408
00:14:45,004 --> 00:14:48,125
I am super interested in, but there that

409
00:14:48,125 --> 00:14:49,264
person's personality

410
00:14:49,565 --> 00:14:51,964
and take on the subject, it is somewhat

411
00:14:51,964 --> 00:14:52,464
interesting.

412
00:14:53,004 --> 00:14:54,845
And, you know, it's it's something I can

413
00:14:54,845 --> 00:14:56,764
listen to while mowing the lawn or something.

414
00:14:56,764 --> 00:14:58,210
You know? It's not not that I have

415
00:14:58,210 --> 00:15:00,370
to pay super attention to the actual subject

416
00:15:00,370 --> 00:15:00,870
matter.

417
00:15:02,210 --> 00:15:05,009
But, you know, that and you're gonna find

418
00:15:05,009 --> 00:15:07,490
all kinds of audience members' preferences are, you

419
00:15:07,490 --> 00:15:08,549
know, gonna vary.

420
00:15:08,850 --> 00:15:11,250
You you do something, somebody's gonna get mad

421
00:15:11,250 --> 00:15:13,304
about it or somebody's gonna really love it,

422
00:15:13,625 --> 00:15:15,325
and it could be the same thing.

423
00:15:16,184 --> 00:15:16,764
You know?

424
00:15:17,464 --> 00:15:20,205
So don't don't don't be afraid to experiment

425
00:15:20,264 --> 00:15:21,164
a little bit.

426
00:15:22,585 --> 00:15:24,745
Again, you know, it's it's your show. Do

427
00:15:24,745 --> 00:15:26,044
what you want. And,

428
00:15:26,799 --> 00:15:27,460
you know,

429
00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:29,700
now for shows that are more

430
00:15:30,639 --> 00:15:31,620
subject oriented

431
00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:34,240
where, you know, you've got a definite niche

432
00:15:34,240 --> 00:15:35,379
and you're definitely

433
00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:37,779
talking about this every time,

434
00:15:38,815 --> 00:15:41,295
you know, then maybe, you know, tighten it

435
00:15:41,295 --> 00:15:42,274
up a little bit.

436
00:15:42,975 --> 00:15:45,215
But, again, like like this show, we, you

437
00:15:45,215 --> 00:15:47,075
know, we do a little fluff in here

438
00:15:47,134 --> 00:15:50,575
sometimes, and sometimes we don't. And we've changed

439
00:15:50,575 --> 00:15:52,335
up formats and all that. I don't think

440
00:15:52,335 --> 00:15:54,595
we're gonna do any major changes this year.

441
00:15:55,110 --> 00:15:57,769
We had talked about it, but I think

442
00:15:58,070 --> 00:15:59,830
I think we're gonna stay about what we're

443
00:15:59,830 --> 00:16:02,789
doing now and, rotate between Mackenzie and Dave

444
00:16:02,789 --> 00:16:03,450
and I.

445
00:16:03,830 --> 00:16:06,009
And sometimes we're gonna have all three,

446
00:16:06,950 --> 00:16:08,169
but, nothing,

447
00:16:08,549 --> 00:16:10,410
you know, nothing jarring, I hope.

448
00:16:11,164 --> 00:16:13,024
Might change might change the artwork.

449
00:16:14,684 --> 00:16:16,764
Yeah. Sometimes that's jarring enough. I mean, that

450
00:16:16,764 --> 00:16:18,304
is something you can talk about.

451
00:16:19,485 --> 00:16:22,684
You know, I, over the years, have changed

452
00:16:22,684 --> 00:16:24,845
artwork because I get sick of looking at

453
00:16:24,845 --> 00:16:27,460
it. Yeah. This was, of of course, when

454
00:16:27,460 --> 00:16:30,200
I was doing it, that that was before

455
00:16:30,500 --> 00:16:33,080
episode artwork was a thing. Yeah. So

456
00:16:33,620 --> 00:16:36,019
I would change out, like, maybe a couple

457
00:16:36,019 --> 00:16:38,420
times a year, and then I would get

458
00:16:38,420 --> 00:16:39,399
feedback. Oh,

459
00:16:39,835 --> 00:16:41,595
I like the blue artwork, and you have

460
00:16:41,595 --> 00:16:43,774
red now, and that was, like, too much.

461
00:16:44,075 --> 00:16:46,235
Okay. So it's back to the blue. And

462
00:16:46,554 --> 00:16:47,054
Yeah.

463
00:16:47,754 --> 00:16:49,674
You know, those are those are changes that

464
00:16:49,674 --> 00:16:52,075
you may not think about. I we've been

465
00:16:52,075 --> 00:16:55,169
talking about format a lot, but you literally

466
00:16:55,230 --> 00:16:56,690
could go through and,

467
00:16:57,549 --> 00:16:59,230
you know, if you have episode numbers at

468
00:16:59,230 --> 00:17:01,089
the beginning or, like, in your titles,

469
00:17:01,470 --> 00:17:03,070
you could put those at the beginning. You

470
00:17:03,070 --> 00:17:04,349
can move them to the back. You can

471
00:17:04,349 --> 00:17:05,569
get rid of them altogether.

472
00:17:06,029 --> 00:17:08,289
I know that there are some people

473
00:17:08,750 --> 00:17:11,494
who just don't care about episode numbers.

474
00:17:12,035 --> 00:17:13,955
It used to be a sticking point for

475
00:17:13,955 --> 00:17:16,434
me because I wanted to know like, that

476
00:17:16,434 --> 00:17:17,255
was a,

477
00:17:20,755 --> 00:17:22,055
that was a point of

478
00:17:22,670 --> 00:17:25,150
measuring my own success. Oh, look at this.

479
00:17:25,150 --> 00:17:27,650
I finally hit episode 30.

480
00:17:28,029 --> 00:17:29,009
Yep. And,

481
00:17:29,630 --> 00:17:30,990
you know and it was cool, like, when

482
00:17:30,990 --> 00:17:33,710
episode 100 came around, and that was a

483
00:17:33,710 --> 00:17:36,484
nice fun episode to to record and be

484
00:17:36,484 --> 00:17:38,505
able to note that it was episode 100.

485
00:17:38,565 --> 00:17:41,065
But most people were like, I don't know.

486
00:17:41,444 --> 00:17:44,184
You talked about that Krampus Christmas movie.

487
00:17:45,204 --> 00:17:46,565
That's that's what it is. I don't know

488
00:17:46,565 --> 00:17:48,005
what number it is. So I ended up

489
00:17:48,005 --> 00:17:49,224
moving episode numbers

490
00:17:49,684 --> 00:17:52,130
out of my titles, and I never mentioned

491
00:17:52,130 --> 00:17:52,630
them

492
00:17:53,250 --> 00:17:55,490
in the actual episode itself. Yeah. I I

493
00:17:55,490 --> 00:17:57,089
do the same thing now. I used to

494
00:17:57,089 --> 00:17:59,170
put them in the, at the end of

495
00:17:59,170 --> 00:18:02,369
the title of the episode, and I've cut

496
00:18:02,369 --> 00:18:03,109
them out.

497
00:18:03,410 --> 00:18:06,230
I do put them in the file name

498
00:18:06,664 --> 00:18:08,105
for the m p three just so I

499
00:18:08,105 --> 00:18:09,164
can keep it straight.

500
00:18:09,464 --> 00:18:11,384
Yeah. But I, you know, I don't make

501
00:18:11,384 --> 00:18:13,065
a big deal about you know, unless it's

502
00:18:13,065 --> 00:18:16,044
a a you know, like, I I crossed

503
00:18:16,105 --> 00:18:16,924
400

504
00:18:16,984 --> 00:18:19,384
sometime last year, and I made a big

505
00:18:19,384 --> 00:18:20,444
deal out of that.

506
00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:23,440
But, otherwise, you know, I don't make a

507
00:18:23,440 --> 00:18:25,599
a deal about what episode number is. I

508
00:18:25,599 --> 00:18:27,839
always, you know, announce the date at the

509
00:18:27,839 --> 00:18:30,160
beginning because, who knows, somebody might be listening

510
00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:32,640
to this, you know, fifteen years from now.

511
00:18:32,640 --> 00:18:33,299
Who knows?

512
00:18:33,845 --> 00:18:36,005
So I, you know, I might, you know,

513
00:18:36,005 --> 00:18:37,924
throw the date in in the in the

514
00:18:37,924 --> 00:18:38,424
intro.

515
00:18:39,125 --> 00:18:40,964
But, you know, in something like what we're

516
00:18:40,964 --> 00:18:43,285
doing here, you know, somebody could listen to

517
00:18:43,285 --> 00:18:43,785
this

518
00:18:44,404 --> 00:18:46,825
five years from now, and it's still relevant.

519
00:18:47,045 --> 00:18:49,990
So the date really doesn't matter. You know,

520
00:18:49,990 --> 00:18:52,490
when we were talking about news and and

521
00:18:52,630 --> 00:18:53,130
topical

522
00:18:53,509 --> 00:18:54,009
things

523
00:18:54,390 --> 00:18:55,289
on this show,

524
00:18:55,589 --> 00:18:57,029
you know, we used to mention the date

525
00:18:57,029 --> 00:18:58,329
and the episode number,

526
00:18:58,789 --> 00:19:00,809
you know, just so people had a context

527
00:19:00,869 --> 00:19:02,710
if they did happen across it five years

528
00:19:02,710 --> 00:19:05,204
from now. Oh, this was back in 2025,

529
00:19:05,204 --> 00:19:06,265
you know, or whatever.

530
00:19:07,045 --> 00:19:09,045
And, you know, so, you know, experiment with

531
00:19:09,045 --> 00:19:11,065
that kind of thing too. Also,

532
00:19:11,365 --> 00:19:13,444
your show notes. You know, how robust do

533
00:19:13,444 --> 00:19:15,144
you want your show notes, and

534
00:19:15,684 --> 00:19:17,785
do people actually notice that?

535
00:19:18,549 --> 00:19:20,789
You know? We we do fairly robust show

536
00:19:20,789 --> 00:19:22,009
notes for this show,

537
00:19:23,349 --> 00:19:23,849
whereas

538
00:19:24,549 --> 00:19:26,570
on some of my other shows, I don't.

539
00:19:26,869 --> 00:19:29,109
You know? I do just enough to let

540
00:19:29,109 --> 00:19:31,394
you know what it's about, and that's it.

541
00:19:31,875 --> 00:19:34,275
And maybe throw relevant links or something in

542
00:19:34,275 --> 00:19:36,674
there, but I really don't, you know, do

543
00:19:36,674 --> 00:19:40,115
this extensive show notes anymore because I really

544
00:19:40,115 --> 00:19:41,875
don't believe a lot of people want or,

545
00:19:41,875 --> 00:19:44,355
you know, read them. Now with us, this

546
00:19:44,355 --> 00:19:46,755
goes on our company blog as well as,

547
00:19:46,755 --> 00:19:48,269
you know, this podcast. So

548
00:19:49,049 --> 00:19:51,069
people do come to that blog,

549
00:19:51,450 --> 00:19:53,289
podcastinsider.com,

550
00:19:53,289 --> 00:19:54,589
just in case you're wondering.

551
00:19:55,769 --> 00:19:58,170
And, they, you know, they do read these

552
00:19:58,170 --> 00:20:00,829
posts even if it is a podcast episode.

553
00:20:01,125 --> 00:20:01,625
You

554
00:20:03,605 --> 00:20:05,785
know? So that's something that you could experiment

555
00:20:05,845 --> 00:20:07,444
with is, you know, how how much show

556
00:20:07,444 --> 00:20:08,825
notes do you wanna do?

557
00:20:10,244 --> 00:20:11,384
Yeah. I mean

558
00:20:12,085 --> 00:20:14,839
yeah. Like, we we have customers that they

559
00:20:14,839 --> 00:20:16,679
love their show notes, and they want them

560
00:20:16,679 --> 00:20:19,480
formatted a specific way, and they want them

561
00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:21,159
to appear in a specific way. And that's

562
00:20:21,159 --> 00:20:23,079
cool. We do everything we can to make

563
00:20:23,079 --> 00:20:23,980
sure that they

564
00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:26,139
that they get what they want.

565
00:20:26,954 --> 00:20:28,095
But then you have

566
00:20:28,554 --> 00:20:30,954
some people like Mike. You know? It's like,

567
00:20:30,954 --> 00:20:33,914
here's two sentences. I talked about a Coney

568
00:20:33,914 --> 00:20:35,934
dog this week, and Yeah.

569
00:20:36,554 --> 00:20:38,634
That's all people care about. Okay. Cool.

570
00:20:39,194 --> 00:20:41,035
I just saw the little description in my

571
00:20:41,035 --> 00:20:44,069
podcast app, and I move on. So

572
00:20:44,369 --> 00:20:46,450
I I think, you know, you're gonna know

573
00:20:46,450 --> 00:20:46,950
if

574
00:20:47,250 --> 00:20:49,669
you messed your show up when people start

575
00:20:49,890 --> 00:20:52,609
contacting you and they're yelling at you or

576
00:20:52,609 --> 00:20:53,829
if you see your your,

577
00:20:54,529 --> 00:20:57,384
your numbers drop. Yeah. You know? Yeah. You

578
00:20:57,384 --> 00:20:59,424
know? And but the thing with the numbers

579
00:20:59,424 --> 00:21:00,325
are, you know,

580
00:21:00,704 --> 00:21:02,805
and this is just a theory of mine,

581
00:21:03,424 --> 00:21:05,605
but if you have a bad episode,

582
00:21:06,464 --> 00:21:09,045
that bad episode probably is gonna get downloaded

583
00:21:09,660 --> 00:21:11,259
as many times as the good ones because

584
00:21:11,259 --> 00:21:12,720
they don't know what's in the episode

585
00:21:13,420 --> 00:21:15,680
until they download it and play it.

586
00:21:16,059 --> 00:21:16,559
But

587
00:21:17,019 --> 00:21:19,019
the next episode is the one you wanna

588
00:21:19,019 --> 00:21:21,039
look at. So if you get a serious

589
00:21:21,100 --> 00:21:23,259
drop in numbers, look at the episode prior

590
00:21:23,259 --> 00:21:24,075
to that one.

591
00:21:24,634 --> 00:21:27,194
That's Yeah. That's, you know, not not so

592
00:21:27,194 --> 00:21:28,414
much that one because

593
00:21:28,954 --> 00:21:30,154
you know? And and if you get a

594
00:21:30,154 --> 00:21:32,714
big bump in an episode, what that could

595
00:21:32,714 --> 00:21:34,875
be is everybody's going, hey. Look at this

596
00:21:34,875 --> 00:21:36,875
and sharing it with friends and stuff. So,

597
00:21:36,875 --> 00:21:38,570
you know, you look at the current episode

598
00:21:38,570 --> 00:21:39,769
if you get a bump. You look at

599
00:21:39,769 --> 00:21:41,950
the past episode if you get a drop.

600
00:21:42,730 --> 00:21:44,590
That's just my theory.

601
00:21:45,450 --> 00:21:47,529
Yeah. That's that's always a good thing. I

602
00:21:47,529 --> 00:21:49,210
know when people get in touch with you

603
00:21:49,210 --> 00:21:49,950
and I,

604
00:21:50,745 --> 00:21:52,265
I mean, that's one of the first things

605
00:21:52,265 --> 00:21:55,144
that we'd we check on our side, but

606
00:21:55,144 --> 00:21:57,384
then we also have them look and go,

607
00:21:57,384 --> 00:21:59,945
well, you know, what what was your previous

608
00:21:59,945 --> 00:22:02,940
episode about in this date range? Can you

609
00:22:02,940 --> 00:22:05,419
think of anything that you might have changed,

610
00:22:05,419 --> 00:22:07,659
or did you show up somewhere that would

611
00:22:07,659 --> 00:22:09,519
cause that to spike or dip?

612
00:22:09,899 --> 00:22:12,319
So, yeah, you just look at trends and

613
00:22:13,179 --> 00:22:15,659
you you eventually, you'll find your answer. It's

614
00:22:15,659 --> 00:22:16,399
not usually,

615
00:22:17,025 --> 00:22:19,125
oh, there's, you know, some

616
00:22:19,904 --> 00:22:22,565
random group of people from Mongolia that are

617
00:22:22,625 --> 00:22:24,785
listening to my episodes now, and that's why

618
00:22:24,785 --> 00:22:27,424
it spiked. Yeah. That that can happen, but

619
00:22:27,424 --> 00:22:28,404
it's pretty rare.

620
00:22:29,619 --> 00:22:30,440
You know, it's

621
00:22:30,899 --> 00:22:32,419
you know, we had one guy,

622
00:22:33,299 --> 00:22:35,480
not too long ago talking about stats.

623
00:22:36,339 --> 00:22:38,279
He says you know, he had, like,

624
00:22:38,740 --> 00:22:41,539
20 downloads per episode was you know? So

625
00:22:41,539 --> 00:22:43,940
he was just, you know, not not really

626
00:22:43,940 --> 00:22:45,079
getting a lot of

627
00:22:45,424 --> 00:22:46,804
plays, a lot of listens.

628
00:22:47,424 --> 00:22:49,605
And he was really curious why

629
00:22:50,224 --> 00:22:52,804
15 of the 20 were in New York.

630
00:22:54,304 --> 00:22:55,204
I don't know.

631
00:22:55,664 --> 00:22:57,444
It's just random happenstance,

632
00:22:57,744 --> 00:22:59,649
I guess, but, you know,

633
00:23:00,269 --> 00:23:02,450
you don't wanna watch it that closely.

634
00:23:04,190 --> 00:23:06,509
But you do wanna you know, if, say,

635
00:23:06,509 --> 00:23:08,289
your episode gets

636
00:23:08,750 --> 00:23:09,569
50%

637
00:23:09,630 --> 00:23:12,115
of what you normally get for an episode,

638
00:23:12,115 --> 00:23:13,394
look at what you did on the last

639
00:23:13,394 --> 00:23:15,875
one and see if you mighta ticked somebody

640
00:23:15,875 --> 00:23:16,694
off, or

641
00:23:16,994 --> 00:23:19,795
you you mighta done something stupid or, you

642
00:23:19,795 --> 00:23:21,875
know, not stupid, but, you know, you you

643
00:23:21,875 --> 00:23:23,414
tried something that didn't work.

644
00:23:23,954 --> 00:23:25,554
I guess that's the better way of putting

645
00:23:25,554 --> 00:23:28,369
it. Yeah. Or, you know, the opposite. Maybe

646
00:23:28,369 --> 00:23:29,349
they did jump.

647
00:23:29,730 --> 00:23:30,390
You know?

648
00:23:31,410 --> 00:23:33,890
So that's that's where stats can come in

649
00:23:33,890 --> 00:23:35,829
and be be of interest.

650
00:23:37,730 --> 00:23:40,355
I think some other things that are maybe

651
00:23:40,355 --> 00:23:43,575
not blueberry centric, but, like, if you are

652
00:23:44,035 --> 00:23:45,715
sharing things on social

653
00:23:46,115 --> 00:23:48,275
Mhmm. You you can check your engagement there,

654
00:23:48,275 --> 00:23:50,515
like, your replies and your you know, if

655
00:23:50,515 --> 00:23:53,255
you're doing reviews on podcast

656
00:23:53,859 --> 00:23:55,559
directories and things like that.

657
00:23:56,659 --> 00:23:58,679
You know, just kinda see how that works.

658
00:23:58,819 --> 00:24:01,000
And those aren't always one to one.

659
00:24:01,619 --> 00:24:03,859
I think I can't even remember. There is

660
00:24:03,859 --> 00:24:06,339
a percentage of people that will interact with

661
00:24:06,339 --> 00:24:06,839
you,

662
00:24:08,085 --> 00:24:09,144
on social media.

663
00:24:09,684 --> 00:24:10,744
But yeah.

664
00:24:11,125 --> 00:24:12,884
Yeah. I get a lot of my my

665
00:24:12,884 --> 00:24:13,384
reactions

666
00:24:13,684 --> 00:24:14,825
from Facebook,

667
00:24:15,684 --> 00:24:16,585
weird weirdly.

668
00:24:18,244 --> 00:24:20,164
But, you know, then I can post the

669
00:24:20,164 --> 00:24:23,000
exact same thing on x and get nothing.

670
00:24:23,299 --> 00:24:25,640
And, you know, I don't use Instagram

671
00:24:25,940 --> 00:24:27,480
yet. Probably will.

672
00:24:27,940 --> 00:24:28,440
But,

673
00:24:28,900 --> 00:24:30,740
you know, it's one of those things. I

674
00:24:30,740 --> 00:24:32,500
can only do so much. I I don't

675
00:24:32,500 --> 00:24:34,740
wanna add yet another inbox to check. You

676
00:24:34,740 --> 00:24:35,240
know?

677
00:24:35,779 --> 00:24:36,279
Right.

678
00:24:36,740 --> 00:24:37,720
But Yeah.

679
00:24:38,154 --> 00:24:39,194
People know how to get a hold of

680
00:24:39,194 --> 00:24:40,174
me if they listen,

681
00:24:40,714 --> 00:24:43,275
so that's good. And, you know, and always

682
00:24:43,275 --> 00:24:44,795
mention that too. You know?

683
00:24:45,434 --> 00:24:47,035
You know, I'm gonna go back a little

684
00:24:47,035 --> 00:24:49,535
bit in our little show notes here, but,

685
00:24:49,595 --> 00:24:52,335
you know, always explain stuff to your audience.

686
00:24:52,394 --> 00:24:53,055
I mean,

687
00:24:53,569 --> 00:24:55,329
you know, there's no no harm in say,

688
00:24:55,329 --> 00:24:57,329
hey. I'm change I changed this up. Did

689
00:24:57,329 --> 00:24:58,710
you notice? What do you think?

690
00:24:59,170 --> 00:25:00,950
You know, let them know what to expect

691
00:25:01,009 --> 00:25:03,910
rather than just shocking them with stuff.

692
00:25:04,450 --> 00:25:06,164
Or, hey. Next week, I got a new

693
00:25:06,164 --> 00:25:08,085
theme song I wanna try out on you.

694
00:25:08,085 --> 00:25:09,444
You know? And that might get them to

695
00:25:09,444 --> 00:25:10,585
come back to hear it.

696
00:25:11,444 --> 00:25:13,865
Just all kinds of stuff like that. But,

697
00:25:14,565 --> 00:25:17,044
yeah, it's a but you you you you

698
00:25:17,044 --> 00:25:18,825
know, if you do something that that

699
00:25:19,369 --> 00:25:22,330
really causes a stir, either positive or negative,

700
00:25:22,330 --> 00:25:24,650
you will hear about it. Oh, yeah. And

701
00:25:24,650 --> 00:25:26,570
that's good. You know, you wanna hear about

702
00:25:26,570 --> 00:25:27,070
it.

703
00:25:27,529 --> 00:25:29,210
Yeah. I don't I would also recommend,

704
00:25:30,890 --> 00:25:31,549
you know,

705
00:25:32,090 --> 00:25:32,990
stick with

706
00:25:34,335 --> 00:25:37,055
the feel of your show. Yeah. Don't you

707
00:25:37,055 --> 00:25:38,835
know, if you have a very professional

708
00:25:39,295 --> 00:25:41,474
show, don't do anything wacky.

709
00:25:42,095 --> 00:25:44,255
You know, if if you use music, don't

710
00:25:44,255 --> 00:25:47,055
change the music to some circus music or

711
00:25:47,055 --> 00:25:48,195
something like that.

712
00:25:49,029 --> 00:25:50,869
You know, kind of stay in your lane,

713
00:25:50,869 --> 00:25:54,230
but but play within those confines a little

714
00:25:54,230 --> 00:25:54,730
bit.

715
00:25:55,430 --> 00:25:56,650
You know, I've I've

716
00:25:57,109 --> 00:25:59,109
not seen too many shows do this, but

717
00:25:59,109 --> 00:26:00,710
I have seen a couple of shows, I've

718
00:26:00,710 --> 00:26:01,849
even done it myself,

719
00:26:02,154 --> 00:26:02,654
where

720
00:26:03,194 --> 00:26:03,934
you go,

721
00:26:05,115 --> 00:26:07,514
well, my personality is, you know, I like

722
00:26:07,595 --> 00:26:09,434
I wanna have a little bit more fun.

723
00:26:09,434 --> 00:26:09,934
So

724
00:26:10,875 --> 00:26:12,714
then you end up making a change that

725
00:26:12,714 --> 00:26:15,134
just doesn't fit the feel of your show,

726
00:26:17,349 --> 00:26:20,650
and that's usually not good. But, yeah, just

727
00:26:20,710 --> 00:26:22,710
just a random thought I had there. You

728
00:26:22,710 --> 00:26:24,390
know? Try and try and stay in your

729
00:26:24,390 --> 00:26:24,890
lane.

730
00:26:25,269 --> 00:26:26,330
Try not to be,

731
00:26:26,789 --> 00:26:28,970
you know, the podcast for all people.

732
00:26:29,865 --> 00:26:32,765
Yep. As they say, a podcast for everybody

733
00:26:32,825 --> 00:26:34,365
is a podcast for nobody.

734
00:26:35,705 --> 00:26:37,545
You know? You gotta niche down a little

735
00:26:37,545 --> 00:26:38,765
bit in most cases.

736
00:26:39,305 --> 00:26:41,160
You know? There are some

737
00:26:41,799 --> 00:26:43,720
celebrities out there that could probably,

738
00:26:44,279 --> 00:26:46,460
read the phone book and and do alright.

739
00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:47,640
So Probably.

740
00:26:48,039 --> 00:26:49,019
You never know.

741
00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:50,220
But,

742
00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:52,840
anyway, yeah, just, you know, here's kind of

743
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,320
the takeaway. You know, experimenting with your format

744
00:26:55,320 --> 00:26:58,224
doesn't mean starting from scratch. It doesn't mean

745
00:26:58,224 --> 00:27:00,705
throwing everything away and starting over, or it

746
00:27:00,705 --> 00:27:02,625
might. You know? And if that's the case,

747
00:27:02,625 --> 00:27:03,684
start a new show.

748
00:27:04,305 --> 00:27:06,625
But Mhmm. Basically, you know, change one thing

749
00:27:06,625 --> 00:27:09,025
at a time. Make sure you're communicating with

750
00:27:09,025 --> 00:27:09,765
your audience,

751
00:27:10,144 --> 00:27:10,545
and,

752
00:27:11,025 --> 00:27:13,570
you know, check the data and the feedback.

753
00:27:17,390 --> 00:27:19,309
Anyway, you don't have to blow it up

754
00:27:19,309 --> 00:27:20,930
to make it better. Yeah.

755
00:27:21,309 --> 00:27:24,190
Think of, you know, tuning or tweaking and

756
00:27:24,190 --> 00:27:24,930
not rebuilding

757
00:27:25,390 --> 00:27:26,850
everything every week.

758
00:27:28,085 --> 00:27:30,404
Yeah. Your your listeners are gonna be a

759
00:27:30,404 --> 00:27:31,144
lot more

760
00:27:31,445 --> 00:27:31,945
adaptable

761
00:27:32,805 --> 00:27:35,285
to to the changes that you make than

762
00:27:35,285 --> 00:27:36,184
you might believe.

763
00:27:36,644 --> 00:27:37,144
So

764
00:27:37,525 --> 00:27:39,365
just make sure you bring them along, put

765
00:27:39,365 --> 00:27:41,845
them in the passenger seat with you, and,

766
00:27:43,090 --> 00:27:45,650
you know, they're gonna love watching your show

767
00:27:45,650 --> 00:27:46,869
grow and change,

768
00:27:47,809 --> 00:27:49,410
and stick around for the long haul. We

769
00:27:49,570 --> 00:27:51,490
I know we do. I love talking to

770
00:27:51,490 --> 00:27:52,630
customers that have,

771
00:27:53,170 --> 00:27:55,970
you know, been doing their podcast for eighteen

772
00:27:55,970 --> 00:27:57,214
years and

773
00:27:57,515 --> 00:27:58,734
and things like that.

774
00:27:59,194 --> 00:27:59,694
So,

775
00:28:01,674 --> 00:28:03,674
yeah, if you want any more advice from

776
00:28:03,674 --> 00:28:05,115
us, you know how to get in touch

777
00:28:05,115 --> 00:28:07,134
with us. You can go to blueberry.com

778
00:28:07,355 --> 00:28:10,015
and, podcastinsider.com

779
00:28:10,180 --> 00:28:10,839
in order

780
00:28:11,539 --> 00:28:13,160
to reach us, whether it's support

781
00:28:13,539 --> 00:28:16,820
or, you know, contact the show. Right. And,

782
00:28:16,820 --> 00:28:19,700
you know, of course, podcastinsider.com,

783
00:28:19,700 --> 00:28:22,019
you can read our extensive show notes. Thanks

784
00:28:22,019 --> 00:28:22,680
to Mackenzie.

785
00:28:24,205 --> 00:28:26,285
Thanks for joining us. Let's meet up next

786
00:28:26,285 --> 00:28:28,305
week. And in the meantime, for more information,

787
00:28:28,605 --> 00:28:31,244
to subscribe, share, or follow, check out the

788
00:28:31,244 --> 00:28:33,904
show notes at podcastinsider.com.

789
00:28:33,967 --> 00:28:35,887
To check out our latest suite of services

790
00:28:35,887 --> 00:28:37,727
and how Blueberry can help you leverage your

791
00:28:37,727 --> 00:28:39,567
podcast, visit blueberry.com.

792
00:28:39,567 --> 00:28:41,427
That's Blueberry without the e's.