A Better Website Experience for Podcasters with Podpage – PCI 480

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- Hey. Welcome back to Podcast Insider.

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- Sorry. We've been for a little bit, but,

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- we've been busy working on some things.

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- And, to that end, I've got, Brandon from,

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- PodPage

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- here.

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- Thank you for having me. Yeah. It's,

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- it's quite a

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- quick project, which, I I was surprised at

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- how quickly it went. You it probably seems

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- slow to you, but

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- for us, it was,

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- it was pretty good. But the the upshot

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- of it is

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- everybody that's a Blueberry hosting customer

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- gets a free pod page, landing page, and

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- the opportunity to upgrade over there and

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- and get the full, PodPage experience.

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- Yeah.

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- I'm excited. You know, when we

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- started PodPage six years ago, I would say,

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- as I looked at the landscape of of

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- what the options were for podcasters,

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- I thought alright. I've always sort of split

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- it into into three buckets.

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- There's

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- the every podcast host gives podcasters,

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- you know, a basic landing page

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- across the board.

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- And,

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- then there was sort of this, like, there

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- was nowhere

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- then there's, like, the Wix and Squarespace

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- sort of point and click your way to

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- a podcast. And then there's WordPress, which in

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- some cases is point and click your way,

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- but it tends to be a lot more

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- of a

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- intense

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- process of putting a putting a page up

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- and keeping it up to date.

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- And so we looked at that opportunity. We

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- said, alright. We can make it easier in

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- that middle area for podcasters to be able

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- to get a podcast

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- focused, easy to build website.

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- And that's kinda that's where we've always sat,

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- but we always I always I mean, I

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- think I talked to several hosts when we

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- first launched, and I said, you know, we

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- could also do this for you. Like, clearly,

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- you know, I look at the landscape of

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- services for podcasters. I always said, you know,

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- do I wanna get into hosting? And I

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- was like, no. Hosting just seems like you

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- really need to focus on being really good

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- at hosting to be good at hosting.

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- And,

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- I'd rather just be focused on being really

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- good with, you know, web publishing for podcasters.

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- And so

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- I would go to the host and say,

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- hey. You know, if you ever want us

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- to help, you know, your landing pages can't

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- be a good use of your resources. Your

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- resources are better set making great hosting products.

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- And so,

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- and and so it's sort of been in

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- the back burner for a long time of,

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- like, we should we it would be really

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- cool to do this, but we've never done

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- it. And so I'm very excited,

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- to launch this with you all. Right. And,

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- you know, and we've always, you know, been

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- WordPress focused,

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- but we do it a little differently than

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- than say, you know, putting your podcast

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- on a WordPress site. We generate the podcast

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- from a WordPress site. Mhmm. And

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- that's good for people that like WordPress or

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- know WordPress.

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- But I'm finding it harder and harder to

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- start new people,

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- you know, down that path. And, you know,

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- so if you're, you know, we'll still support

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- WordPress,

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- fully, but,

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- you know, this is just

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- a much

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- easier

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- onboarding

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- for people and gives them, you know, the

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- same advantages

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- as, you know, building your own website. That's

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- why you are building a website. You're just

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- doing it based on

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- the RSS feed and,

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- you know, I I just, you know, it's

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- a no brainer. I I don't know why

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- we didn't do it before. Well,

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- truth be told, we were gonna try to

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- build a competitor to you,

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- and that was how that all started. And

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- we got to look at it. This is

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- hard and, you know, we're not good at

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- this.

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- So why don't we just, give it to

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- somebody that's,

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- good at it, and then we can focus

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- on what we're good at? You know, it's

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- funny. I a lot of people look at

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- PodPage,

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- especially on the more technical

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- side of my world, And they say this,

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- you know, this is the dumbest little

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- simple product.

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- You know? It's like you've got a podcast.

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- They there's there's data in there. You just

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- make a website based on the product. And

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- it was. I mean, for the first couple

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- weeks of building it, it was pretty simple.

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- And then it was like, oh, the amount

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- of

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- nuance that goes into doing it well

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- still surprises me.

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- I still spend tons of time refining it

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- and smoothing out bugs and following new Google

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- and schema guidelines on how to represent you

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- know, audio on a website so that Google

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- and now the AI tools can understand what

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- it is. It's just it ends up being

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- an endless list of

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- of things, and then you take into account

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- what users typically will want to do to

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- customize it. And,

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- you know, you know, it starts easy, and

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- then it just keeps going. And, you have

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- to have this you have to sort of

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- hold the line on, well, what's gonna be

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- and I I think that we've faltered on

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- this many times over the six years where

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- we've added way too much customization. I'm actually

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- working on,

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- starting to dig into a project right now

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- to simplify

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- the dashboard

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- because there's just we've we've built too much.

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- There's too many features on it. There's areas

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- that we've gone astray. I mean, like, we

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- built this thing that really isn't core to

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- podcast websites. And,

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- yeah, 10 users used it, but not thousands

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- of users. And because it's there, it's made

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- the the platform harder to to navigate and

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- all that. So

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- there's just a lot to it. It's not

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- just a quick landing page,

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- if you want to serve people's needs of

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- having a good website. And so Well, it

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- works the same way with hosting. You know,

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- you build a feature and 12 people use

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- it.

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- Is it worth keeping that feature around? Yeah.

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- Yeah. You know, so a lot of lot

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- of what we've been doing this year is,

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- is we call it pair and polish. You

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- know, we're getting rid of stuff that we're

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- not good at or isn't used, and we're

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- polishing up the stuff that we are good

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- at and people will use.

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- And that's always been, you know, this this

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- year has been kind of our focus, and,

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- you know, the PodPage,

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- integration was, was just like a no brainer,

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- you know, when you I don't know whether

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- I came to you first or you came

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- to me first or how that all worked,

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- but,

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- I I think it, it's I think it's

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- gonna be successful on, on both parts. Yeah.

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- We're seeing some some uptake for sure. And,

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- you know, what you've done with, you know,

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- just just the basic,

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- landing pages that we had, just sort of

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- replicating that, making those better

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- has just made a world of difference in

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- how they look and, you know, how they

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- act. And,

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- yeah, I'm I'm loving it. I you know,

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- I was a PodPage customer

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- prior to that. I I wanted to try

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- you guys out, on a on a little

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- side project I had going, and

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- and,

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- yeah, I'm loving it. Well, I think one

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- of the core when you and I started

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- talking about this, it was there was a

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- few at least, I believe, there was a

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- few core things that we needed to get

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- right if we were to do it. One

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- of them was you all have always always

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- hosted your landing pages on podcast.show, or that's

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- what you're currently they're currently on. Right? And

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- so when we moved the back end of

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- the website

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- management from

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- the Blueberry side to the pod page side,

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- the number one thing was no links can

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- break. Right? It's still gonna be podcast.show

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- slash whatever the podcast name is. Like, this

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- this can't have any effect on your existing

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- customers. They just will see look at their

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- website one day, and it will look better,

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- probably have have better SEO,

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- and just happen to be hosted on our

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- back end. But for most customers we talked

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- about, we were like, they won't even know

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- they won't know or care. They'll just see

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- that they have a nicer looking website. Yeah.

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- And so that was sort of point number

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- one as we were like, let's make sure

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- that it's a it's there's no negative. It's

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- just better for the existing users. And then

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- for anyone who cares enough to who, like,

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- in the past might have said, okay. I

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- want something better.

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- Well, in the past, they would have had

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- to migrate over to a pod page or

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- a Squarespace or a WordPress. You know, they

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- would have to create a new website and

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- then move it over.

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- It's not as wanna make this easy where

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- it's just a button. Right? They just it's

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- the same website. Everything's the same. They just

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- hit a button, and then they can upgrade

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- and add a bunch of features. And so

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- I feel like we got those two things.

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- Like, those are sort of the two things

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- we wanted to get really right. And then

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- the third

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- was,

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- you know, there's I don't know how many

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- there's hundreds of design settings in pod page

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- to make your site look different. The one

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- thing we didn't want people to do was

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- if they wanted to just change their color,

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- they had to sign up for PodPage, find

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- it in the dashboard, go through this whole

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- process. So we were like, let's just make

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- a couple settings

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- basic settings. You change your color. You can

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- change your dark mode. You can change your

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- URL.

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- You don't need to create a pod page

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- account. You don't even need to know pod

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- page exists to do that. You can just

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- do that through Blueberry. If you wanna get

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- heavy handed with your customization, then come over

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- and claim it, and you have all the

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- all the features and tools. Yeah.

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- So I I think at this point, it's

262
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- it's landed pretty well.

263
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- It's been really fun to work with your

264
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- team on initial user feedback and figure out

265
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- what we need to make better,

266
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- figure out what's working and what's not. So,

267
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- Yeah. So far, I haven't run into anything

268
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- that's,

269
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- been a show stopper.

270
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- No pun intended.

271
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- But, you know, it but, you know, our

272
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- core value here at Blueberry is you should

273
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- have your own website,

274
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- and that's also, you know, PodPage is core

275
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- one of their core you know, one of

276
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- your core values over there, and it's just

277
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- been

278
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- I don't know. It's this is probably the

279
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- smoothest integration we've ever done with anybody. I'd

280
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- I'm, you know, highly impressed and, you know,

281
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- Grant and,

282
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- Aaron and couple other people on our team

283
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- and

284
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- and then, I guess, just you

285
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- doing the dev on your side. And, yeah,

286
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- it's it's it's slick. I I I am

287
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- impressed,

288
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- and, you know, I would encourage you if

289
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- you, you know, if you are hosting customer

290
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- with us,

291
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- you know, go ahead and claim your page

292
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- over there. See what you can do. There's

293
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- quite a bit of,

294
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- of customization.

295
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- And, you know,

296
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- How much do you need? You know? Who

297
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- knows? But that's that's up to the individual.

298
00:10:02.149 --> 00:10:04.389
- Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, right now, every

299
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- we set it up where every Blueberry customer

300
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- has,

301
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- the same template with different colors depending on

302
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- what your podcast artwork is. We we kinda

303
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- make a guess looking at your podcast artwork

304
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- and say, here's what your primary color is.

305
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- And we set up the page and then,

306
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- and then, you know, you can change dark

307
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- mode, you can change colors, but when you

308
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- come in, you can choose an entirely different

309
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- design template and you can make tons of

310
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- design customizations. And so,

311
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- so, you know, for someone who just is

312
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- like, I like the page, but maybe it

313
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- doesn't represent the brand that I'm trying to

314
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- push out there. Maybe I've got, like, a

315
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- true crime podcast, and I want something that

316
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- doesn't have rounded corners and is darker. And,

317
00:10:42.975 --> 00:10:44.975
- you know, like, there's just certain tones. Like,

318
00:10:44.975 --> 00:10:46.174
- you can come in, and you can probably

319
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- find a template that'll do that for you

320
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- and do tons of design customizations

321
00:10:49.294 --> 00:10:51.214
- too. You know, then I work a lot

322
00:10:51.214 --> 00:10:52.995
- in support as well and

323
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- and,

324
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- not having to worry about,

325
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- you know, my fonts look funny or, you

326
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- know, all that stuff that you guys are

327
00:11:01.100 --> 00:11:03.340
- good at that Yeah. You know, I I'm

328
00:11:03.340 --> 00:11:05.420
- not a web designer. There's there's no way

329
00:11:05.420 --> 00:11:07.365
- in heck I can make a decent looking

330
00:11:07.365 --> 00:11:08.485
- website Yeah.

331
00:11:09.044 --> 00:11:10.345
- You know, by myself.

332
00:11:11.044 --> 00:11:13.284
- And so, you know, you know, and I've

333
00:11:13.284 --> 00:11:15.384
- I've really familiar with WordPress,

334
00:11:16.804 --> 00:11:18.804
- and I can make it do most of

335
00:11:18.804 --> 00:11:20.164
- what I want to do, but I find

336
00:11:20.164 --> 00:11:21.990
- it a lot easier with you guys, guys,

337
00:11:22.149 --> 00:11:24.889
- for for myself even just design wise.

338
00:11:25.990 --> 00:11:27.990
- Well, I mean, WordPress is amazing. We I

339
00:11:27.990 --> 00:11:28.970
- always tell people

340
00:11:29.429 --> 00:11:31.509
- when a customer of PodPage, even long term

341
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- customers come to me and say, hey. I'm

342
00:11:33.669 --> 00:11:35.865
- quitting. I'm closing my countdown, and I say,

343
00:11:35.865 --> 00:11:37.065
- oh, what's you know, what did we do

344
00:11:37.065 --> 00:11:38.264
- wrong? They're like, no. We just need to

345
00:11:38.264 --> 00:11:40.504
- move to WordPress because we need our business

346
00:11:40.504 --> 00:11:42.205
- is growing, and we need more customization

347
00:11:42.745 --> 00:11:44.825
- than you all offer. You know, in in

348
00:11:44.825 --> 00:11:47.065
- some cases, someone like me might then run

349
00:11:47.065 --> 00:11:49.629
- and try to, like, build a million toggles

350
00:11:49.629 --> 00:11:51.169
- to try to make them happy.

351
00:11:52.429 --> 00:11:54.049
- Yeah. But in most cases,

352
00:11:54.589 --> 00:11:56.350
- you know, I'm super thrilled for them because

353
00:11:56.350 --> 00:11:58.190
- I'm like, oh, like, if you need that

354
00:11:58.190 --> 00:12:00.705
- level of customization, that means you probably have

355
00:12:00.705 --> 00:12:02.865
- are making some good money, have a big

356
00:12:02.865 --> 00:12:05.285
- audience, have someone who can help you

357
00:12:05.665 --> 00:12:07.205
- get what you need out of WordPress.

358
00:12:07.985 --> 00:12:09.665
- And that's always a great step. I mean,

359
00:12:09.665 --> 00:12:11.985
- they're taking a step up because they're they're

360
00:12:11.985 --> 00:12:13.985
- they're not leaving because of some dumb reason.

361
00:12:13.985 --> 00:12:16.090
- They're leaving because they they just need more

362
00:12:16.090 --> 00:12:17.610
- than I can give them. And if we

363
00:12:17.610 --> 00:12:20.009
- made our platform as customizable as WordPress, then

364
00:12:20.009 --> 00:12:21.450
- we would be then it would be too

365
00:12:21.450 --> 00:12:23.610
- hard to use for everyone else. Yeah. And

366
00:12:23.610 --> 00:12:25.450
- that's You know? I think WordPress is amazing.

367
00:12:25.450 --> 00:12:26.970
- It's just it's amazing if you need a

368
00:12:26.970 --> 00:12:28.649
- certain set of things. But in most cases,

369
00:12:28.649 --> 00:12:31.095
- it's overkill, especially at the beginning of a

370
00:12:31.095 --> 00:12:32.075
- project. You know,

371
00:12:32.534 --> 00:12:34.855
- the the good thing about WordPress is it's

372
00:12:34.855 --> 00:12:35.355
- customizable.

373
00:12:35.894 --> 00:12:38.714
- Bad thing about WordPress is it's customizable,

374
00:12:39.735 --> 00:12:42.554
- and you can really, you know, mess up.

375
00:12:43.254 --> 00:12:45.669
- And, of course, a lot of the Internet

376
00:12:45.669 --> 00:12:46.889
- or a lot of the web

377
00:12:47.590 --> 00:12:50.070
- is WordPress, so that makes it kind of

378
00:12:50.070 --> 00:12:52.230
- more of a target than some of the,

379
00:12:52.230 --> 00:12:54.409
- you know, some of the other web technology.

380
00:12:55.350 --> 00:12:57.029
- So you have to, you know, be concerned

381
00:12:57.029 --> 00:12:59.350
- with security. You gotta, you know, there's there's

382
00:13:00.035 --> 00:13:01.875
- I mean, it's, like I said, we fully

383
00:13:01.875 --> 00:13:04.195
- support it, and, you know, we will continue

384
00:13:04.195 --> 00:13:06.835
- to do so, but, you know, it's not

385
00:13:06.835 --> 00:13:07.575
- for everybody.

386
00:13:08.115 --> 00:13:10.514
- Mhmm. And so, you know, we're it's nice

387
00:13:10.514 --> 00:13:12.295
- to be able to expand our

388
00:13:12.919 --> 00:13:13.819
- web presence,

389
00:13:14.440 --> 00:13:15.579
- for our customers

390
00:13:16.199 --> 00:13:17.019
- through you guys.

391
00:13:17.720 --> 00:13:20.759
- Yep. And we talked to other other web

392
00:13:20.759 --> 00:13:24.120
- companies about, you know, adding podcasting to their

393
00:13:24.120 --> 00:13:25.179
- platform, and

394
00:13:25.924 --> 00:13:27.625
- and that kinda went nowhere.

395
00:13:28.404 --> 00:13:31.204
- So which is fine. You know? Yeah. You

396
00:13:31.204 --> 00:13:32.725
- know, if you you wanna do a Wix

397
00:13:32.725 --> 00:13:34.404
- site, do a Wix site, but you're gonna

398
00:13:34.404 --> 00:13:36.804
- have to manually publish your show. This is

399
00:13:36.804 --> 00:13:38.664
- this is pretty automatic.

400
00:13:39.710 --> 00:13:42.110
- And, you know, you guys have Podping now,

401
00:13:42.670 --> 00:13:44.830
- which is cool, so that makes it update

402
00:13:44.830 --> 00:13:47.470
- a little bit quicker. And and Yeah. That

403
00:13:47.470 --> 00:13:48.750
- was fun. I mean, we we've I've looked

404
00:13:48.750 --> 00:13:50.670
- at Podping for a long time. You know,

405
00:13:50.670 --> 00:13:52.590
- the way that we typically update websites is

406
00:13:52.590 --> 00:13:54.049
- it's a pretty involved

407
00:13:54.774 --> 00:13:55.274
- scheduler

408
00:13:55.975 --> 00:13:57.834
- depending on when the last podcast

409
00:13:58.534 --> 00:14:00.774
- episode was released, depending on what your generic

410
00:14:00.934 --> 00:14:03.174
- what's your general release cadence is. You know,

411
00:14:03.174 --> 00:14:05.414
- we try to my ultimate goal, it saves

412
00:14:05.414 --> 00:14:07.975
- us work, and it saves post bandwidth, but

413
00:14:07.975 --> 00:14:08.554
- I wanna

414
00:14:08.879 --> 00:14:10.720
- only check the feed when I think there's

415
00:14:10.720 --> 00:14:12.080
- gonna might be a new episode. I don't

416
00:14:12.080 --> 00:14:13.519
- wanna just check it all the time. But

417
00:14:13.519 --> 00:14:14.960
- it's hard because you kinda don't know. I

418
00:14:14.960 --> 00:14:16.720
- mean, a podcaster might release a random episode

419
00:14:16.720 --> 00:14:18.320
- on a Tuesday even though they always release

420
00:14:18.320 --> 00:14:20.480
- on Thursday. Mhmm. And if you're not checking

421
00:14:20.480 --> 00:14:22.399
- on Tuesday, then they're mad because we didn't

422
00:14:22.399 --> 00:14:24.340
- pull in the episode. And so

423
00:14:24.774 --> 00:14:26.534
- I've we've got a we've always had some

424
00:14:26.534 --> 00:14:28.294
- kind of, like, a kind of a crazy

425
00:14:28.294 --> 00:14:30.695
- calculus on when to check next, and we

426
00:14:30.695 --> 00:14:33.254
- always over index on check more often than

427
00:14:33.254 --> 00:14:33.815
- not. Yeah.

428
00:14:34.455 --> 00:14:35.654
- But we'll you know, if we see that

429
00:14:35.654 --> 00:14:37.174
- you haven't released an episode in a couple

430
00:14:37.174 --> 00:14:38.960
- weeks or a couple months or a couple

431
00:14:39.039 --> 00:14:41.200
- you know, we'll Yeah. We'll start really backing

432
00:14:41.200 --> 00:14:43.200
- off. But we always try to check, you

433
00:14:43.200 --> 00:14:44.879
- know, to see if there's anything there if

434
00:14:44.879 --> 00:14:47.059
- you're an active paying customer. But with Podping,

435
00:14:48.080 --> 00:14:49.379
- it's nice because we can

436
00:14:49.725 --> 00:14:51.644
- we can just we get a ping from

437
00:14:51.644 --> 00:14:53.084
- you all that says, hey. There's a new

438
00:14:53.084 --> 00:14:54.784
- episode out. Mhmm. And

439
00:14:55.404 --> 00:14:56.924
- we can then immediately check the feed. And

440
00:14:56.924 --> 00:14:58.684
- then if we if we are confident, hey.

441
00:14:58.684 --> 00:15:00.625
- We're getting the latest info,

442
00:15:01.084 --> 00:15:03.164
- then we can stop pinging Blueberry all the

443
00:15:03.164 --> 00:15:05.245
- time about new episodes because we're

444
00:15:05.909 --> 00:15:06.889
- I will say,

445
00:15:08.070 --> 00:15:10.070
- and I won't name any any hosting names,

446
00:15:10.070 --> 00:15:11.750
- but what I what I have found, we

447
00:15:11.750 --> 00:15:14.070
- started getting since we introduced this, we've started

448
00:15:14.070 --> 00:15:16.230
- getting, I would say, an uptick of customer

449
00:15:16.230 --> 00:15:19.509
- support emails around episodes not updating. And what

450
00:15:19.509 --> 00:15:20.870
- I was looking into it, and what I

451
00:15:20.870 --> 00:15:21.370
- found

452
00:15:22.045 --> 00:15:25.165
- was there are some places that some hosts

453
00:15:25.165 --> 00:15:25.985
- that use Podpink

454
00:15:26.524 --> 00:15:27.024
- that

455
00:15:27.644 --> 00:15:28.144
- will

456
00:15:28.845 --> 00:15:31.504
- that the customer goes in, they update their

457
00:15:32.045 --> 00:15:32.545
- show,

458
00:15:33.245 --> 00:15:35.485
- the Podpink goes out, we check the feed.

459
00:15:35.485 --> 00:15:37.230
- When we check the feed, the feed is

460
00:15:37.230 --> 00:15:38.289
- either cached

461
00:15:38.750 --> 00:15:39.250
- or,

462
00:15:40.110 --> 00:15:41.870
- it so it's almost like the host says,

463
00:15:41.870 --> 00:15:43.470
- hey. There's a new episode. We then check,

464
00:15:43.470 --> 00:15:44.850
- and there is no new episode.

465
00:15:45.149 --> 00:15:46.590
- Yeah. But what we were doing is we

466
00:15:46.590 --> 00:15:47.950
- were saying, oh, well, if we're getting pod

467
00:15:47.950 --> 00:15:49.629
- pings, then let's not check for new episodes

468
00:15:49.629 --> 00:15:51.735
- as often. So we actually made this update

469
00:15:51.735 --> 00:15:52.475
- last week

470
00:15:52.855 --> 00:15:54.774
- where we started getting all these tickets saying,

471
00:15:54.774 --> 00:15:56.855
- hey. I'm not my episodes aren't publishing till,

472
00:15:56.855 --> 00:15:58.214
- like, six hours later. And I was like,

473
00:15:58.214 --> 00:15:59.495
- well, that's because in sick what we do

474
00:15:59.495 --> 00:16:01.095
- is we basically say, like, wait a bunch

475
00:16:01.095 --> 00:16:03.815
- of hours before we check again. Because in

476
00:16:03.815 --> 00:16:04.315
- theory,

477
00:16:04.759 --> 00:16:06.360
- we just got the new episode. We don't

478
00:16:06.360 --> 00:16:08.039
- need to be checking. And then we looked,

479
00:16:08.039 --> 00:16:09.899
- and we were like, oh, in certain cases,

480
00:16:09.960 --> 00:16:12.279
- the feed actually isn't up to date when

481
00:16:12.279 --> 00:16:13.419
- the ping goes out

482
00:16:13.799 --> 00:16:15.399
- or it's cached or something like that. And

483
00:16:15.399 --> 00:16:17.240
- so we've had to I mean, we're still

484
00:16:17.240 --> 00:16:19.245
- tweaking it, but there's a lot of promise

485
00:16:19.245 --> 00:16:21.004
- to it being to being great. I wish

486
00:16:21.004 --> 00:16:21.504
- that,

487
00:16:22.365 --> 00:16:24.304
- now I'm just getting into Podping, but,

488
00:16:24.684 --> 00:16:26.445
- I wish, you know, we get this update

489
00:16:26.445 --> 00:16:28.764
- calls whenever something happens. Mhmm. And it would

490
00:16:28.764 --> 00:16:30.865
- be awesome if Podping included

491
00:16:31.409 --> 00:16:33.250
- little bit more context about what the update

492
00:16:33.250 --> 00:16:34.929
- was because we get this the ping goes

493
00:16:34.929 --> 00:16:37.250
- out regardless if you added an episode or

494
00:16:37.250 --> 00:16:39.490
- updated your episode number in an episode from

495
00:16:39.490 --> 00:16:41.889
- a year ago. Like, there's it basically just

496
00:16:41.889 --> 00:16:43.829
- says, hey. The feed is updated. Go

497
00:16:44.365 --> 00:16:45.965
- poll it. And it would be really cool

498
00:16:45.965 --> 00:16:47.245
- if it was like, hey. There's a pod

499
00:16:47.245 --> 00:16:50.285
- ping because episode 54 has new summary or

500
00:16:50.285 --> 00:16:52.684
- something like that. That would that's my desire

501
00:16:52.684 --> 00:16:54.045
- for the future would be just like a

502
00:16:54.045 --> 00:16:55.105
- teeny bit of metadata

503
00:16:55.565 --> 00:16:57.485
- to let us know what to look for

504
00:16:57.485 --> 00:16:59.110
- because that would be even more helpful. But

505
00:16:59.350 --> 00:17:01.269
- Right. But, you know, it it it does

506
00:17:01.269 --> 00:17:04.230
- improve the the update time in most cases.

507
00:17:04.230 --> 00:17:05.910
- You know? Yeah. Of course, if the feed's

508
00:17:05.910 --> 00:17:08.150
- cached, that doesn't help you any. But I

509
00:17:08.150 --> 00:17:10.309
- think we made some fixes that that address

510
00:17:10.309 --> 00:17:12.309
- some of that. But Dave Jackson, who, you

511
00:17:12.309 --> 00:17:13.769
- know, former Libsyn

512
00:17:14.204 --> 00:17:16.924
- employee and our head of podcasting and school

513
00:17:16.924 --> 00:17:19.724
- podcasting founder and just awesome overall person, he

514
00:17:19.724 --> 00:17:21.505
- has 12 podcasts or something.

515
00:17:21.884 --> 00:17:24.224
- He, you know, even on our team, he

516
00:17:24.284 --> 00:17:25.804
- ping pinged me, and he was like, I

517
00:17:25.804 --> 00:17:27.539
- can't believe how fast it updates. He's like,

518
00:17:27.539 --> 00:17:28.779
- I, like, hit I think he it was

519
00:17:28.779 --> 00:17:30.660
- a Captivate show. He's got shows on every

520
00:17:30.660 --> 00:17:31.940
- platform. Sure. And,

521
00:17:32.820 --> 00:17:34.500
- and because he was always constantly checking the

522
00:17:34.500 --> 00:17:35.940
- new features and stuff like that. And so

523
00:17:35.940 --> 00:17:37.400
- he was like, I updated on Captivate,

524
00:17:37.700 --> 00:17:38.980
- or maybe it was one of his Blueberry

525
00:17:38.980 --> 00:17:40.019
- shows, and he was like and by the

526
00:17:40.019 --> 00:17:41.265
- time I got back, I mean, I just

527
00:17:41.265 --> 00:17:43.025
- went over to Gmail. I already had an

528
00:17:43.025 --> 00:17:44.625
- update from PodPage saying we just pulled in

529
00:17:44.625 --> 00:17:46.144
- your new episode. He was like, I just

530
00:17:46.144 --> 00:17:46.805
- hit save.

531
00:17:47.265 --> 00:17:49.184
- So it was it's very cool when it

532
00:17:49.184 --> 00:17:51.424
- works well. It's just Yeah. Now if we

533
00:17:51.424 --> 00:17:54.065
- could just get Apple and Spotify to use

534
00:17:54.065 --> 00:17:54.565
- PodPing

535
00:17:55.730 --> 00:17:57.490
- That would be also amazing. That would be

536
00:17:57.490 --> 00:18:00.070
- good, you know, because I I think probably

537
00:18:01.250 --> 00:18:02.130
- 25%

538
00:18:02.130 --> 00:18:04.690
- of our support tickets is, I just published

539
00:18:04.690 --> 00:18:06.869
- my episode, and it's not on Apple yet.

540
00:18:07.330 --> 00:18:07.830
- Yep.

541
00:18:09.164 --> 00:18:11.085
- And that's Well, yeah, someone else, you know,

542
00:18:11.085 --> 00:18:13.565
- the whole again, some and sometimes it's caching

543
00:18:13.565 --> 00:18:15.244
- because I I we were dealing with a

544
00:18:15.244 --> 00:18:17.565
- person who released at 9AM on, you know,

545
00:18:17.565 --> 00:18:19.884
- Tuesdays. And so Mhmm. He said, hey. My

546
00:18:19.884 --> 00:18:22.045
- episode didn't publish. I just hit publish. And

547
00:18:22.045 --> 00:18:23.005
- I went to his feed, and I was

548
00:18:23.005 --> 00:18:24.299
- like, it's not in your feed. I mean,

549
00:18:24.299 --> 00:18:25.519
- I don't like it could

550
00:18:26.460 --> 00:18:28.559
- be some somewhere in the caching layer.

551
00:18:29.019 --> 00:18:30.700
- It's just not in your we can't get

552
00:18:30.700 --> 00:18:31.900
- it because it's not in your feed. I

553
00:18:31.900 --> 00:18:33.500
- know you hit publish on whatever the hosting

554
00:18:33.500 --> 00:18:34.620
- platform was, but,

555
00:18:34.940 --> 00:18:36.299
- it just hasn't. You got to give it

556
00:18:36.299 --> 00:18:38.154
- a little bit of time. But Yeah. There's

557
00:18:38.154 --> 00:18:40.075
- always there's always a little bit of lag

558
00:18:40.075 --> 00:18:40.575
- there.

559
00:18:40.954 --> 00:18:41.454
- And,

560
00:18:41.994 --> 00:18:42.734
- you know, the

561
00:18:43.035 --> 00:18:45.535
- thing we we run into with caching

562
00:18:45.994 --> 00:18:48.575
- is is similar to you. You know? They

563
00:18:49.674 --> 00:18:52.460
- they'll have, like, I I I've logged into

564
00:18:52.460 --> 00:18:54.779
- people's WordPress there, or had them log into

565
00:18:54.779 --> 00:18:57.200
- it on a Zoom call, and they'll have

566
00:18:57.819 --> 00:18:59.119
- four different caching

567
00:18:59.819 --> 00:19:00.319
- plugins.

568
00:19:01.819 --> 00:19:02.799
- Like, really?

569
00:19:04.299 --> 00:19:06.654
- You know, you're gonna clear your cache. Yeah.

570
00:19:06.654 --> 00:19:08.494
- You publish something, you know, and then WordPress

571
00:19:08.494 --> 00:19:09.954
- is supposed to do that.

572
00:19:10.575 --> 00:19:12.255
- And, you know, on our platform, you know,

573
00:19:12.255 --> 00:19:14.115
- when you're doing it right from Blueberry,

574
00:19:15.934 --> 00:19:17.855
- we do a pretty good job of clearing

575
00:19:17.855 --> 00:19:18.595
- that cache.

576
00:19:19.055 --> 00:19:20.035
- You know, that's

577
00:19:20.690 --> 00:19:23.170
- that's one of the things that that happens

578
00:19:23.170 --> 00:19:25.089
- when you hit publish. It just, you know,

579
00:19:25.089 --> 00:19:26.710
- we put it in the feed,

580
00:19:27.089 --> 00:19:27.990
- clear the cache.

581
00:19:28.529 --> 00:19:29.750
- And, you know, sometimes,

582
00:19:30.130 --> 00:19:31.809
- you know, you know how the Internet is.

583
00:19:32.049 --> 00:19:33.890
- Things don't always work the way you want

584
00:19:33.890 --> 00:19:34.869
- them to. But

585
00:19:35.595 --> 00:19:36.634
- But it is. I mean, it's true. We

586
00:19:36.714 --> 00:19:38.234
- there's also I mean, there's so many layers

587
00:19:38.234 --> 00:19:39.515
- of caching, and caching is great. And for

588
00:19:39.515 --> 00:19:41.755
- anyone who's nontechnical listening to this, caching is

589
00:19:41.755 --> 00:19:43.994
- essentially you just save whatever the thing that

590
00:19:43.994 --> 00:19:45.674
- was in the database in memory. So it's

591
00:19:45.674 --> 00:19:47.355
- faster when someone goes to look at it.

592
00:19:47.355 --> 00:19:49.115
- So every time someone hits your website, when

593
00:19:49.115 --> 00:19:50.619
- you go to pod page, most cases, when

594
00:19:50.619 --> 00:19:52.940
- you go to PodPage, it's not pulling all

595
00:19:52.940 --> 00:19:55.019
- the data from the PodPage database. It's it's

596
00:19:55.019 --> 00:19:57.200
- saving it in memory, which is much faster,

597
00:19:57.500 --> 00:19:59.500
- puts less load on the database, which makes

598
00:19:59.500 --> 00:20:01.500
- everything faster. So the page loads faster, which

599
00:20:01.500 --> 00:20:03.259
- makes Google happy, and so Google ends up

600
00:20:03.259 --> 00:20:05.339
- ranking your website higher because it's a faster

601
00:20:05.339 --> 00:20:08.184
- page load. It just moves less information across

602
00:20:08.184 --> 00:20:10.285
- the Internet. It's it's generally

603
00:20:10.825 --> 00:20:13.065
- what most people will do. And so it's

604
00:20:13.065 --> 00:20:15.065
- good. But the problem with caching and saving

605
00:20:15.065 --> 00:20:16.744
- things in memory is if something gets updated

606
00:20:16.744 --> 00:20:18.025
- in the database and you go to the

607
00:20:18.025 --> 00:20:19.869
- website and you haven't

608
00:20:20.330 --> 00:20:23.130
- erased that, like, memory layer, it's not gonna

609
00:20:23.130 --> 00:20:24.970
- get the new update from the database and

610
00:20:24.970 --> 00:20:26.890
- then something will seem old. That's what we're

611
00:20:26.890 --> 00:20:29.289
- talking about. Right. So Yeah. This is this

612
00:20:29.289 --> 00:20:31.769
- is a lot on the GeekGear side. Yeah.

613
00:20:31.769 --> 00:20:34.515
- Many people will put many layers of cache.

614
00:20:34.595 --> 00:20:36.195
- You know, we have in our code base,

615
00:20:36.195 --> 00:20:37.954
- we have a a layer of cache, but

616
00:20:37.954 --> 00:20:39.075
- then there's also when you go to the

617
00:20:39.075 --> 00:20:41.954
- domain name, the domain name sits behind has

618
00:20:41.954 --> 00:20:44.674
- cache. So this is a common it's like

619
00:20:44.674 --> 00:20:46.515
- cache is a blessing and a curse because

620
00:20:46.515 --> 00:20:47.335
- for an engineer,

621
00:20:47.634 --> 00:20:49.315
- it's it's always used to be a joke

622
00:20:49.315 --> 00:20:50.369
- where it was just like,

623
00:20:50.849 --> 00:20:52.210
- it's broken. Oh, we'll just look at the

624
00:20:52.210 --> 00:20:53.490
- caching. Because you do all this work to

625
00:20:53.490 --> 00:20:54.690
- change a feature and then it doesn't work.

626
00:20:54.690 --> 00:20:56.390
- It's like, oh, it's because the cache hasn't

627
00:20:56.529 --> 00:20:58.690
- updated yet. I run I run into that,

628
00:20:58.690 --> 00:21:00.230
- like I said, all the time, and

629
00:21:00.690 --> 00:21:01.190
- and

630
00:21:01.730 --> 00:21:01.809
- it

631
00:21:02.615 --> 00:21:05.174
- you know, caching's good. It speeds things up.

632
00:21:05.174 --> 00:21:06.555
- But, you know,

633
00:21:07.335 --> 00:21:09.914
- less horsepower needed on the server and,

634
00:21:10.295 --> 00:21:12.215
- you know, the whole whole thing. But, you

635
00:21:12.215 --> 00:21:14.055
- know, like I said, we're this this an

636
00:21:14.055 --> 00:21:17.015
- episode's a little geekier than than the average,

637
00:21:17.015 --> 00:21:18.394
- but, that's alright.

638
00:21:18.910 --> 00:21:20.190
- These are but so this isn't a good

639
00:21:20.190 --> 00:21:21.730
- example of these are the things that

640
00:21:22.029 --> 00:21:24.529
- a podcaster definitely shouldn't have to worry about.

641
00:21:24.589 --> 00:21:27.250
- Right. Right? Definitely shouldn't have to worry about.

642
00:21:27.710 --> 00:21:29.470
- And which is why, you know, places like

643
00:21:29.470 --> 00:21:32.054
- Blueberry and PodPage exist because, you know, in

644
00:21:32.054 --> 00:21:33.734
- twenty years ago, the podcaster was having to

645
00:21:33.734 --> 00:21:35.255
- figure out how to set up audio files

646
00:21:35.255 --> 00:21:36.154
- on their own server.

647
00:21:36.535 --> 00:21:39.255
- And so but but then, you know, taking

648
00:21:39.255 --> 00:21:40.855
- it a step further, some of the stuff

649
00:21:40.855 --> 00:21:43.575
- is stuff that like, website caching is something

650
00:21:43.575 --> 00:21:45.730
- that Blueberry shouldn't have to worry about. Blueberry

651
00:21:45.730 --> 00:21:47.649
- should be working on caching their or, you

652
00:21:47.649 --> 00:21:50.049
- know, making their own feeds faster and getting

653
00:21:50.049 --> 00:21:52.130
- Apple to update faster and all that stuff.

654
00:21:52.130 --> 00:21:54.130
- It shouldn't be making their landing pages load

655
00:21:54.130 --> 00:21:56.210
- faster. And so that's what that's why I

656
00:21:56.210 --> 00:21:57.829
- feel like working with you all and

657
00:21:59.044 --> 00:22:00.724
- and being able to do that on our

658
00:22:00.724 --> 00:22:03.044
- end makes it just better for everyone. You

659
00:22:03.044 --> 00:22:04.724
- will you can spend more time focused on

660
00:22:04.724 --> 00:22:06.884
- making a great posting product, and podcasters can

661
00:22:06.884 --> 00:22:09.125
- spend more time just focusing on podcasting and

662
00:22:09.125 --> 00:22:10.025
- creating content.

663
00:22:10.484 --> 00:22:11.924
- And then we can just handle that one

664
00:22:11.924 --> 00:22:14.389
- website layer. So Right. Yeah. You know, there's

665
00:22:14.589 --> 00:22:16.670
- well, a lot of things are changing in

666
00:22:16.670 --> 00:22:17.970
- the podcast world,

667
00:22:19.390 --> 00:22:21.569
- you know, especially around video.

668
00:22:21.869 --> 00:22:23.809
- So that that's gonna be a whole another

669
00:22:25.255 --> 00:22:26.634
- a whole another thing

670
00:22:27.335 --> 00:22:28.694
- coming soon as,

671
00:22:29.095 --> 00:22:31.095
- you know, as all this support for video.

672
00:22:31.095 --> 00:22:33.015
- So, you know, we were really getting an

673
00:22:33.015 --> 00:22:35.994
- education over here. You know, we've always supported

674
00:22:36.134 --> 00:22:38.615
- video the old fashioned way by sending it

675
00:22:38.615 --> 00:22:39.515
- out in enclosures,

676
00:22:40.470 --> 00:22:43.109
- but, now it's gonna be a little more

677
00:22:43.109 --> 00:22:43.609
- complicated.

678
00:22:43.990 --> 00:22:44.890
- Thanks, Apple.

679
00:22:46.470 --> 00:22:48.710
- But that's alright. You know? It's a better

680
00:22:48.710 --> 00:22:50.009
- experience for the listener,

681
00:22:50.470 --> 00:22:52.970
- the viewer, however you wanna put that.

682
00:22:53.515 --> 00:22:56.315
- So I'm fascinated by by what's happening with

683
00:22:56.315 --> 00:22:57.214
- video because

684
00:22:57.674 --> 00:22:58.174
- in

685
00:22:59.515 --> 00:23:01.835
- in in some cases and this is maybe

686
00:23:01.835 --> 00:23:04.734
- a controversial comment because podcasting is open.

687
00:23:05.115 --> 00:23:06.494
- But in some cases,

688
00:23:07.194 --> 00:23:07.855
- the the

689
00:23:08.279 --> 00:23:09.019
- the podcasting

690
00:23:09.320 --> 00:23:11.100
- openness moved so slow

691
00:23:11.640 --> 00:23:12.460
- on video

692
00:23:12.840 --> 00:23:14.859
- that it almost ceded

693
00:23:16.200 --> 00:23:18.840
- it to YouTube because, like, you know, a

694
00:23:18.840 --> 00:23:20.600
- podcaster who needs a video version of their

695
00:23:20.600 --> 00:23:22.380
- podcast, that is a solved problem,

696
00:23:23.505 --> 00:23:25.585
- because most people put it on YouTube. And

697
00:23:25.585 --> 00:23:27.744
- so to the point where now people call

698
00:23:27.744 --> 00:23:29.904
- YouTube channels podcasts, and they don't even have

699
00:23:29.904 --> 00:23:31.664
- a feed because they just have a you

700
00:23:31.664 --> 00:23:33.345
- know? And so the whole thing got so

701
00:23:33.345 --> 00:23:35.825
- inverted, and the word got so misused that

702
00:23:35.825 --> 00:23:38.080
- it's gonna be interesting to see see what

703
00:23:38.080 --> 00:23:40.340
- Apple and Spotify I mean, spot I think

704
00:23:40.640 --> 00:23:42.400
- video support in these players is good, but

705
00:23:42.480 --> 00:23:43.920
- and, you know, I talked to some podcast

706
00:23:43.920 --> 00:23:44.720
- and they're like, oh, wait. So now I've

707
00:23:44.720 --> 00:23:46.320
- gotta upload it to my host and also

708
00:23:46.320 --> 00:23:47.840
- YouTube. Do I still put it on YouTube?

709
00:23:47.840 --> 00:23:49.519
- Can I just use my YouTube as my

710
00:23:49.680 --> 00:23:51.244
- I already have my YouTube one set up?

711
00:23:51.244 --> 00:23:52.605
- Can I just play that in Apple? And,

712
00:23:52.605 --> 00:23:54.525
- of course, Apple doesn't wanna be so the

713
00:23:54.525 --> 00:23:56.544
- whole thing Right. For PodPage,

714
00:23:56.845 --> 00:23:58.285
- what we do with video and we've done

715
00:23:58.285 --> 00:24:00.924
- for years is when if you set it

716
00:24:00.924 --> 00:24:03.085
- up, you set tell us what your YouTube

717
00:24:03.085 --> 00:24:05.680
- channel is or your YouTube playlist for your

718
00:24:05.680 --> 00:24:08.000
- episodes. And when we import an episode from

719
00:24:08.000 --> 00:24:10.799
- your feed, we go over to your YouTube

720
00:24:10.799 --> 00:24:11.299
- playlist

721
00:24:11.840 --> 00:24:14.240
- for your episodes, and we find the find

722
00:24:14.240 --> 00:24:16.720
- the matching one. We import that and associate

723
00:24:16.720 --> 00:24:18.240
- it with your episode. And then on your

724
00:24:18.240 --> 00:24:18.740
- website,

725
00:24:19.474 --> 00:24:21.234
- you have your audio player with from and

726
00:24:21.234 --> 00:24:23.234
- that player is a Blueberry player or Buzzsprout

727
00:24:23.234 --> 00:24:25.075
- player, whoever it happens to be your host.

728
00:24:25.075 --> 00:24:26.855
- And then above it is a big YouTube

729
00:24:26.994 --> 00:24:29.075
- thing. And we I mean, I focused on

730
00:24:29.075 --> 00:24:29.815
- that early

731
00:24:30.515 --> 00:24:32.134
- because if you're going to a website

732
00:24:32.769 --> 00:24:33.829
- to hear an episode,

733
00:24:34.130 --> 00:24:36.609
- you're probably not just gonna hit play on

734
00:24:36.609 --> 00:24:38.130
- a player and sit there and stare at

735
00:24:38.130 --> 00:24:38.789
- the screen.

736
00:24:40.289 --> 00:24:41.490
- At that point, you might as well the

737
00:24:41.490 --> 00:24:43.089
- goal should be get them into Spotify or

738
00:24:43.089 --> 00:24:45.029
- Apple or wherever they're listening to their podcast.

739
00:24:45.494 --> 00:24:46.855
- But there's a video on the screen. You

740
00:24:46.855 --> 00:24:48.214
- actually just might sit there and watch it.

741
00:24:48.214 --> 00:24:50.134
- And so it was, like, because websites need

742
00:24:50.134 --> 00:24:51.734
- to be visual, let's make sure that this

743
00:24:51.734 --> 00:24:52.234
- thing

744
00:24:52.855 --> 00:24:54.535
- shows the video. So it's a it's a

745
00:24:54.694 --> 00:24:57.015
- we just actually moved that feature from our

746
00:24:57.015 --> 00:24:59.130
- sort of our top tier into our middle

747
00:24:59.130 --> 00:25:00.970
- tier, which is our more more popular tier

748
00:25:00.970 --> 00:25:02.809
- because it's just such a better experience for

749
00:25:02.809 --> 00:25:03.470
- end users.

750
00:25:04.970 --> 00:25:07.130
- But it's YouTube reliant. Right? And if you

751
00:25:07.130 --> 00:25:08.650
- do have YouTube if you have video in

752
00:25:08.650 --> 00:25:10.170
- your feed through HLS or any of these

753
00:25:10.170 --> 00:25:10.830
- other mechanisms,

754
00:25:11.215 --> 00:25:12.894
- that'll show up on the pod page feed

755
00:25:12.894 --> 00:25:15.375
- also just automatically. But up to this point,

756
00:25:15.375 --> 00:25:17.535
- everyone's just sort of been more YouTube focused.

757
00:25:17.535 --> 00:25:19.775
- So Yeah. We we kinda flipped the script

758
00:25:19.775 --> 00:25:21.154
- on them with our Vidtopod,

759
00:25:22.255 --> 00:25:23.235
- project. Mhmm.

760
00:25:24.340 --> 00:25:26.680
- So, you know, we can turn your

761
00:25:27.140 --> 00:25:28.360
- YouTube playlist

762
00:25:28.740 --> 00:25:32.200
- into an actual audio podcast. It's not video.

763
00:25:32.340 --> 00:25:33.160
- It's audio.

764
00:25:33.860 --> 00:25:35.940
- But, you know, there's a lot of YouTube

765
00:25:35.940 --> 00:25:38.180
- channels. It's just a couple guys talking into

766
00:25:38.180 --> 00:25:41.115
- a microphone, so, you know, the visual part

767
00:25:41.115 --> 00:25:42.654
- of it isn't as important.

768
00:25:43.355 --> 00:25:43.994
- Yep. But,

769
00:25:44.795 --> 00:25:45.934
- yeah, that's We,

770
00:25:48.715 --> 00:25:50.795
- we had two things. I used to actually

771
00:25:50.795 --> 00:25:53.295
- help people manually. It wasn't as as

772
00:25:54.559 --> 00:25:56.799
- nice as your solution. But I went to

773
00:25:56.799 --> 00:25:58.900
- a couple this is probably four years ago.

774
00:25:59.359 --> 00:26:00.579
- I used to go to

775
00:26:00.880 --> 00:26:02.740
- YouTube channels that I respected

776
00:26:03.119 --> 00:26:04.960
- Mhmm. Who didn't have pod who didn't even

777
00:26:04.960 --> 00:26:06.319
- consider it a podcast. It was just their

778
00:26:06.319 --> 00:26:07.515
- YouTube thing. And I was like, why don't

779
00:26:07.515 --> 00:26:09.994
- you you're interviewing people on YouTube. Like, just

780
00:26:09.994 --> 00:26:11.375
- turn just take the audio

781
00:26:11.674 --> 00:26:13.455
- and do a podcast. Now probably

782
00:26:13.835 --> 00:26:15.615
- was, a little more

783
00:26:17.515 --> 00:26:18.875
- meticulous about it than I should have been

784
00:26:18.875 --> 00:26:19.994
- because I would set them up with an

785
00:26:19.994 --> 00:26:21.990
- audio editor, and I you know, we would

786
00:26:21.990 --> 00:26:24.549
- make a really nice sounding podcast. We'd remix

787
00:26:24.549 --> 00:26:27.029
- the audio, and we'd add intros, and we

788
00:26:27.109 --> 00:26:28.710
- we'd sort of framed it up to be

789
00:26:28.710 --> 00:26:29.289
- a podcast.

790
00:26:30.950 --> 00:26:32.710
- And with the goal of, hey. If this

791
00:26:32.869 --> 00:26:34.710
- you know, whoever the creator was, you pay

792
00:26:34.710 --> 00:26:37.194
- this editor x amount of dollars per episode,

793
00:26:37.194 --> 00:26:38.794
- they'll just do everything and it'll set and

794
00:26:38.794 --> 00:26:40.394
- we'll release it into the feed, and it'll

795
00:26:40.394 --> 00:26:41.914
- be on all the channels. I probably did

796
00:26:41.914 --> 00:26:43.855
- that for half a dozen to a dozen

797
00:26:44.234 --> 00:26:44.734
- people,

798
00:26:45.914 --> 00:26:47.609
- and thinking, oh, this will grow the market.

799
00:26:47.690 --> 00:26:48.589
- But, like, ultimately,

800
00:26:48.970 --> 00:26:50.730
- it kinda was too expensive for them because

801
00:26:50.730 --> 00:26:52.089
- they were like, well, we, you know, can't

802
00:26:52.089 --> 00:26:54.329
- we just do this automatically? So it's your

803
00:26:54.329 --> 00:26:56.250
- solution I didn't know about or didn't exist

804
00:26:56.250 --> 00:26:57.150
- back then. But,

805
00:26:57.529 --> 00:26:58.970
- I think it's it's like a no brainer

806
00:26:58.970 --> 00:27:00.250
- because I would say to these people, hey,

807
00:27:00.250 --> 00:27:02.394
- you're already doing the work. You're doing all

808
00:27:02.394 --> 00:27:03.375
- of the hard stuff,

809
00:27:03.755 --> 00:27:05.914
- and you're missing a distribution channel. Even if

810
00:27:05.914 --> 00:27:08.394
- you get 10 listens a week from Apple

811
00:27:08.394 --> 00:27:11.434
- Podcasts or, you know, whatever, Spotify, it's better

812
00:27:11.434 --> 00:27:13.195
- to do that than to not get those

813
00:27:13.195 --> 00:27:14.414
- listens. You never know.

814
00:27:14.954 --> 00:27:15.454
- So

815
00:27:15.799 --> 00:27:16.460
- Yeah. Yeah.

816
00:27:16.839 --> 00:27:18.279
- I I I listen to a show. This

817
00:27:18.279 --> 00:27:19.660
- guy is prolific.

818
00:27:20.519 --> 00:27:24.220
- He does two episodes on YouTube a day,

819
00:27:24.359 --> 00:27:27.419
- fifteen minutes apiece, you know, just single story

820
00:27:28.355 --> 00:27:28.855
- episodes.

821
00:27:29.154 --> 00:27:30.515
- And I'm like, I don't want to sit

822
00:27:30.515 --> 00:27:32.535
- and watch you talk into your microphone.

823
00:27:33.474 --> 00:27:35.414
- Let's do this. So I got him on

824
00:27:35.474 --> 00:27:35.974
- Vidapod,

825
00:27:36.275 --> 00:27:38.355
- and it's been great. You know, I can

826
00:27:38.355 --> 00:27:40.434
- be out mowing the lawn, whatever, you know?

827
00:27:40.434 --> 00:27:40.934
- So

828
00:27:41.240 --> 00:27:43.340
- because, you know, what he's doing wasn't necessarily

829
00:27:43.400 --> 00:27:43.900
- visual.

830
00:27:44.440 --> 00:27:47.160
- Yeah. But, yeah, I think, you know, with

831
00:27:47.160 --> 00:27:48.619
- all this, you know, HLS

832
00:27:49.000 --> 00:27:49.500
- and

833
00:27:49.960 --> 00:27:52.140
- and, you know, all the different video

834
00:27:52.599 --> 00:27:54.759
- channels, you know, ultimately, it'd be nice to

835
00:27:54.759 --> 00:27:56.380
- just upload it once somewhere,

836
00:27:57.214 --> 00:27:59.775
- have it go everywhere. Mhmm. And I think

837
00:27:59.775 --> 00:28:01.934
- we're gonna get to that goal sometime this

838
00:28:01.934 --> 00:28:02.434
- year

839
00:28:02.974 --> 00:28:04.894
- with Blueberry as well as, you know, I'm

840
00:28:04.894 --> 00:28:06.654
- sure others are doing the same sort of

841
00:28:06.654 --> 00:28:07.795
- thing. And Yeah.

842
00:28:08.335 --> 00:28:08.994
- I tried

843
00:28:10.640 --> 00:28:12.400
- pre at the beginning of PodPage, I was

844
00:28:12.400 --> 00:28:14.799
- like, oh, I'll build a suite of tools

845
00:28:14.799 --> 00:28:15.539
- for podcasters

846
00:28:15.920 --> 00:28:18.180
- that solve specific problems. So I had PodPage.

847
00:28:18.559 --> 00:28:19.620
- I had Pod Reviews,

848
00:28:20.000 --> 00:28:22.320
- which was just import reviews and tweet them

849
00:28:22.320 --> 00:28:24.340
- and build a dashboard to analyze them.

850
00:28:26.404 --> 00:28:27.065
- It wasn't

851
00:28:28.325 --> 00:28:29.924
- you know, there was a couple tools that

852
00:28:29.924 --> 00:28:31.605
- were like that already out there, and they

853
00:28:31.605 --> 00:28:32.964
- were they did a great job. But I

854
00:28:32.964 --> 00:28:34.404
- kinda was like, oh, there's people who I'm

855
00:28:34.404 --> 00:28:36.005
- building a bunch of stuff that helps is

856
00:28:36.005 --> 00:28:38.164
- helpful for the website, but, also, there's people

857
00:28:38.164 --> 00:28:40.105
- who are on WordPress who might want this.

858
00:28:40.330 --> 00:28:42.509
- And so one of them was PodTube,

859
00:28:44.009 --> 00:28:46.009
- because everything has to be called Pod something.

860
00:28:46.009 --> 00:28:47.630
- And Or Tube something.

861
00:28:48.009 --> 00:28:50.730
- Yeah. And so PodTube was literally like, okay.

862
00:28:50.730 --> 00:28:52.650
- Once we import your audio, we're gonna create

863
00:28:52.650 --> 00:28:54.090
- a video version of it, which is just,

864
00:28:54.090 --> 00:28:56.200
- you know, your artwork with an audiogram. We're

865
00:28:56.200 --> 00:28:58.086
- gonna post it on YouTube. Same concept, like

866
00:28:58.322 --> 00:29:00.444
- but we I never released it, a, I

867
00:29:00.444 --> 00:29:02.330
- think it was expensive to run, and b,

868
00:29:02.330 --> 00:29:04.216
- it was, like, it just wasn't a good

869
00:29:04.216 --> 00:29:06.102
- product. Like, no one wants to sit on

870
00:29:06.102 --> 00:29:08.224
- YouTube and just look at an an audiogram

871
00:29:08.224 --> 00:29:09.740
- play. So Well, that's that's how,

872
00:29:10.299 --> 00:29:12.960
- podcasts get distributed to YouTube now.

873
00:29:13.339 --> 00:29:15.500
- You can put your RSS feed in over

874
00:29:15.500 --> 00:29:16.000
- there,

875
00:29:16.619 --> 00:29:18.380
- and they'll do a it's not even an

876
00:29:18.380 --> 00:29:21.039
- audiogram. It's just static image. Yeah.

877
00:29:21.419 --> 00:29:22.399
- And Yeah.

878
00:29:22.714 --> 00:29:24.494
- It's, you know, it's not compelling.

879
00:29:25.195 --> 00:29:26.575
- No. It's not. The the

880
00:29:26.875 --> 00:29:28.954
- the Google and I disclaimer, I used to

881
00:29:28.954 --> 00:29:31.134
- work for Google before doing podcasting.

882
00:29:32.075 --> 00:29:34.095
- But watching their their

883
00:29:34.474 --> 00:29:37.035
- podcast strategy or lack thereof of a podcast

884
00:29:37.035 --> 00:29:38.174
- strategy has been,

885
00:29:39.619 --> 00:29:40.119
- interesting.

886
00:29:40.659 --> 00:29:41.799
- They've been moving around.

887
00:29:42.579 --> 00:29:43.859
- And then when they were, like, they had

888
00:29:43.859 --> 00:29:45.460
- their big, like, the big launch was part

889
00:29:45.460 --> 00:29:48.500
- of YouTube music, and now podcasters have their

890
00:29:48.500 --> 00:29:50.259
- YouTube channel with their podcast, but then they

891
00:29:50.259 --> 00:29:52.695
- also have a YouTube music, channel, like, playlist.

892
00:29:52.755 --> 00:29:53.815
- It's so confusing.

893
00:29:54.434 --> 00:29:56.994
- Yeah. And it's very typical of I mean,

894
00:29:56.994 --> 00:29:58.355
- I've seen it at other big companies, but

895
00:29:58.355 --> 00:29:59.875
- Google without they didn't wanna make a hard

896
00:29:59.875 --> 00:30:02.275
- decision and just, like, you know, choose one

897
00:30:02.275 --> 00:30:03.634
- path. They were choosing a bunch of paths,

898
00:30:03.634 --> 00:30:05.015
- and now it's very confusing

899
00:30:05.419 --> 00:30:06.859
- where they you know, you think about it.

900
00:30:06.859 --> 00:30:07.980
- They really should have run away with the

901
00:30:07.980 --> 00:30:08.640
- whole thing.

902
00:30:09.179 --> 00:30:10.179
- Yeah. They could have,

903
00:30:10.619 --> 00:30:11.359
- for sure.

904
00:30:12.380 --> 00:30:14.319
- You know, we had a had a customer

905
00:30:14.380 --> 00:30:15.839
- that did, Vidapod.

906
00:30:16.380 --> 00:30:18.319
- So they had a playlist on YouTube.

907
00:30:18.619 --> 00:30:20.079
- They made it into an audio,

908
00:30:20.724 --> 00:30:23.464
- and then they submitted it to YouTube music.

909
00:30:24.964 --> 00:30:27.224
- So what that did was created a loop

910
00:30:28.325 --> 00:30:29.304
- because the

911
00:30:29.605 --> 00:30:32.085
- fake video would go on YouTube in their

912
00:30:32.085 --> 00:30:32.585
- channel,

913
00:30:33.259 --> 00:30:35.259
- and then we would pull that down again

914
00:30:35.660 --> 00:30:37.340
- Uh-huh. Make an audio, put it in the

915
00:30:37.340 --> 00:30:38.480
- RSS feed.

916
00:30:39.580 --> 00:30:41.660
- So, you know, I looked at this guy's

917
00:30:41.660 --> 00:30:43.740
- YouTube channel, and he had, like, every other

918
00:30:43.820 --> 00:30:46.154
- you know, it was a video, an audio,

919
00:30:46.214 --> 00:30:47.595
- a video, an audio

920
00:30:47.894 --> 00:30:49.035
- of the same episode,

921
00:30:50.214 --> 00:30:51.494
- you know, for, like

922
00:30:52.055 --> 00:30:53.575
- it was probably 50 of them on there

923
00:30:53.575 --> 00:30:55.015
- by the time I figured out what was

924
00:30:55.015 --> 00:30:56.234
- going on. Uh-huh.

925
00:30:56.694 --> 00:30:57.515
- That's funny.

926
00:30:57.815 --> 00:30:58.855
- We have a lot of people who will

927
00:31:01.180 --> 00:31:02.460
- well, they used to do this. We sort

928
00:31:02.460 --> 00:31:03.820
- of women, they can still do it, but

929
00:31:03.820 --> 00:31:05.660
- they'll set up that YouTube matching that I

930
00:31:05.660 --> 00:31:07.039
- talked about. It's all automated,

931
00:31:07.660 --> 00:31:09.259
- but it'll end up pulling in sort of

932
00:31:09.259 --> 00:31:12.059
- a static image YouTube video. Mhmm. And so

933
00:31:12.059 --> 00:31:13.259
- you go to their website, and there's the

934
00:31:13.259 --> 00:31:15.595
- blueberry player or whatever player they use. And

935
00:31:15.595 --> 00:31:17.195
- then above it, there's a YouTube player that

936
00:31:17.195 --> 00:31:18.795
- just shows the artwork, and you just listen

937
00:31:18.795 --> 00:31:20.075
- to it. And I have to go to

938
00:31:20.075 --> 00:31:21.835
- them and say, this is not adding any

939
00:31:21.835 --> 00:31:24.154
- additional user value to the page. Like, take

940
00:31:24.154 --> 00:31:26.235
- it off because it's distracting. You because users

941
00:31:26.235 --> 00:31:27.355
- will come and be like, I must be

942
00:31:27.355 --> 00:31:28.795
- doing something wrong. I'm hitting play on the

943
00:31:28.795 --> 00:31:30.269
- video, and it's not showing me a video.

944
00:31:30.269 --> 00:31:31.890
- It's just showing me the big album cover

945
00:31:32.109 --> 00:31:34.910
- that's right below it. Yeah. So And video,

946
00:31:34.910 --> 00:31:36.930
- you know, video is harder to do.

947
00:31:37.549 --> 00:31:39.410
- That's the other thing for users.

948
00:31:39.950 --> 00:31:40.849
- You know, it's

949
00:31:41.150 --> 00:31:42.750
- bad enough if you, you know, have to

950
00:31:42.750 --> 00:31:44.130
- edit your audio.

951
00:31:45.070 --> 00:31:45.570
- Well,

952
00:31:46.054 --> 00:31:48.134
- jeez. You know, if you got video and

953
00:31:48.134 --> 00:31:50.134
- audio that you gotta deal with, you know,

954
00:31:50.134 --> 00:31:52.315
- so I, you know, I I

955
00:31:52.775 --> 00:31:55.174
- don't know whether, you know, it's gonna really

956
00:31:55.174 --> 00:31:58.315
- take off like, people suspect it will.

957
00:31:59.660 --> 00:32:02.059
- But, you know, the the option's there. That's

958
00:32:02.059 --> 00:32:03.819
- the that's the good thing. You know, you

959
00:32:03.819 --> 00:32:05.740
- can do as much or as little as

960
00:32:05.740 --> 00:32:08.079
- you want and still get your word out.

961
00:32:08.539 --> 00:32:09.599
- I think it's nice

962
00:32:10.460 --> 00:32:10.960
- if,

963
00:32:14.875 --> 00:32:16.335
- in the cases where

964
00:32:17.275 --> 00:32:19.115
- it will be okay. I think the perfect

965
00:32:19.115 --> 00:32:21.755
- world and I Spotify does this pretty well

966
00:32:21.755 --> 00:32:23.195
- at this point. They're the only ones that

967
00:32:23.195 --> 00:32:24.955
- do it well when they have a video

968
00:32:24.955 --> 00:32:26.955
- podcast. It's nice to be, in some cases,

969
00:32:26.955 --> 00:32:28.414
- being able to sit and watch

970
00:32:29.400 --> 00:32:32.119
- the show Mhmm. People chatting with each other,

971
00:32:32.119 --> 00:32:33.400
- you know, because I'm sitting in front of

972
00:32:33.400 --> 00:32:35.000
- my computer. And then when I get in

973
00:32:35.000 --> 00:32:37.160
- my car, it just continues, and I'm now

974
00:32:37.160 --> 00:32:39.160
- listening to it. And there's no you know,

975
00:32:39.160 --> 00:32:41.480
- where before or for most most cases, you

976
00:32:41.480 --> 00:32:42.840
- know, you watch the YouTube you're watching it

977
00:32:42.840 --> 00:32:43.934
- on YouTube, then you get in your car,

978
00:32:43.934 --> 00:32:45.295
- you pull it up on Apple Podcasts or

979
00:32:45.295 --> 00:32:46.654
- Spotify, and then you have to find where

980
00:32:46.654 --> 00:32:48.654
- you were in the show. Like, so that

981
00:32:48.654 --> 00:32:50.255
- that seamless handoff, I think there's gonna be

982
00:32:50.255 --> 00:32:51.934
- value there once it's figured out. Yeah. App

983
00:32:52.015 --> 00:32:54.015
- Apple's doing the same thing and,

984
00:32:54.495 --> 00:32:56.575
- you know, Spotify you know, but Spotify was

985
00:32:56.575 --> 00:32:59.315
- the first that were was doing it properly.

986
00:32:59.769 --> 00:33:01.069
- Now I pay YouTube

987
00:33:01.690 --> 00:33:04.089
- for the privilege of being able to stick

988
00:33:04.089 --> 00:33:06.009
- the phone in my pocket with the screen

989
00:33:06.089 --> 00:33:07.710
- and still listen to

990
00:33:08.329 --> 00:33:10.750
- YouTube. So that, you know,

991
00:33:11.130 --> 00:33:14.009
- that sort of is there too, but you

992
00:33:14.009 --> 00:33:15.309
- have to pay them for it.

993
00:33:15.634 --> 00:33:16.134
- Yeah.

994
00:33:16.595 --> 00:33:18.375
- You know, but I I think, you know,

995
00:33:18.434 --> 00:33:20.855
- the HLS, that makes it a little easier.

996
00:33:20.914 --> 00:33:22.755
- But the the thing is is if you

997
00:33:22.755 --> 00:33:24.914
- want your audio to be different than your

998
00:33:24.914 --> 00:33:27.095
- video, then that's not gonna work for you.

999
00:33:27.154 --> 00:33:27.654
- Yep.

1000
00:33:28.195 --> 00:33:29.255
- You know, which,

1001
00:33:30.190 --> 00:33:31.890
- you know, that's okay. You know?

1002
00:33:32.509 --> 00:33:34.509
- Just, you know, because a lot of people

1003
00:33:34.509 --> 00:33:36.029
- like to take the audio out of their

1004
00:33:36.029 --> 00:33:37.950
- video and then edit it up and put

1005
00:33:37.950 --> 00:33:40.430
- intros and and all that stuff. And, well,

1006
00:33:40.430 --> 00:33:41.950
- in that case, do it the old way

1007
00:33:41.950 --> 00:33:44.670
- with two feeds. No big deal. Yep. You

1008
00:33:44.670 --> 00:33:46.255
- know? That was one thing I was gonna

1009
00:33:46.255 --> 00:33:48.174
- ask you about. Maybe not this may not

1010
00:33:48.174 --> 00:33:49.454
- be the right place, but,

1011
00:33:49.974 --> 00:33:52.255
- you know, what if I have one show

1012
00:33:52.255 --> 00:33:53.474
- but with two feeds?

1013
00:33:54.095 --> 00:33:56.195
- Is that something that's even possible?

1014
00:33:57.214 --> 00:33:59.339
- You end up So I forget what who

1015
00:33:59.339 --> 00:34:01.200
- the first person who did this was.

1016
00:34:02.779 --> 00:34:05.039
- It's it's been sort of, like, on the

1017
00:34:05.500 --> 00:34:07.900
- do we build something to solve this problem

1018
00:34:07.900 --> 00:34:09.679
- list for five years

1019
00:34:10.155 --> 00:34:12.474
- because it only really comes up maybe once

1020
00:34:12.474 --> 00:34:14.235
- a year where someone comes in and says,

1021
00:34:14.235 --> 00:34:15.994
- I've got these two feeds. Now a lot

1022
00:34:15.994 --> 00:34:17.515
- of for for the first few years, it

1023
00:34:17.515 --> 00:34:18.875
- was I have an audio feed and a

1024
00:34:18.875 --> 00:34:21.054
- video feed. Can I load them both in?

1025
00:34:21.675 --> 00:34:22.974
- The way that we built

1026
00:34:23.639 --> 00:34:26.279
- PodPage was is very much reliant on there

1027
00:34:26.279 --> 00:34:28.519
- is one website per feed. Yeah. Right? You

1028
00:34:28.519 --> 00:34:30.359
- just have this one website, and it's linked

1029
00:34:30.359 --> 00:34:32.199
- to a feed, and the episodes come in

1030
00:34:32.199 --> 00:34:33.799
- from that one feed. So the concept of

1031
00:34:33.799 --> 00:34:35.480
- saying, like, oh, one website could have multiple

1032
00:34:35.480 --> 00:34:35.980
- feeds

1033
00:34:36.425 --> 00:34:37.864
- never I mean, that would be such a

1034
00:34:37.864 --> 00:34:40.545
- re rearchitecture of the system that Sure. Yeah.

1035
00:34:40.744 --> 00:34:42.925
- We never kind of considered doing it. But,

1036
00:34:43.864 --> 00:34:45.945
- where we went with so this you know,

1037
00:34:45.945 --> 00:34:47.465
- the only time that ever happens where it's

1038
00:34:47.465 --> 00:34:48.445
- kind of multiple

1039
00:34:48.824 --> 00:34:49.965
- websites per

1040
00:34:50.360 --> 00:34:52.360
- multiple feeds per website is our network product

1041
00:34:52.360 --> 00:34:53.960
- where if you're a network, you can come

1042
00:34:53.960 --> 00:34:56.539
- and say, hey. I've got 10 different shows,

1043
00:34:56.840 --> 00:34:58.199
- and I'd like to put them all at

1044
00:34:58.199 --> 00:34:59.400
- mynetwork.com.

1045
00:34:59.400 --> 00:35:00.840
- And so the way that works is you

1046
00:35:00.840 --> 00:35:02.760
- essentially have mynetwork.com

1047
00:35:02.760 --> 00:35:08.094
- is where the show sit. And then mynetwork.com/show/mikeshow

1048
00:35:08.474 --> 00:35:08.974
- is

1049
00:35:09.675 --> 00:35:10.175
- is

1050
00:35:10.635 --> 00:35:12.474
- on the not mynetwork.com,

1051
00:35:12.474 --> 00:35:14.394
- but it's its own kind of it's actually,

1052
00:35:14.394 --> 00:35:15.989
- in our system, a totally different website.

1053
00:35:16.550 --> 00:35:18.969
- But it just sits underneath the main website.

1054
00:35:19.190 --> 00:35:21.269
- And so that solution doesn't really work well

1055
00:35:21.269 --> 00:35:22.869
- for someone who has, you know, a couple

1056
00:35:22.869 --> 00:35:23.929
- podcasts or

1057
00:35:25.269 --> 00:35:26.469
- because most of the time, they want their

1058
00:35:26.469 --> 00:35:28.864
- podcast to be different brands anyway. And then

1059
00:35:28.864 --> 00:35:30.425
- if you have one podcast that's a video

1060
00:35:30.425 --> 00:35:31.785
- and an audio, then you end up having

1061
00:35:31.785 --> 00:35:32.905
- this weird thing where you kind of have

1062
00:35:32.905 --> 00:35:34.585
- two websites for the same podcast, and it's

1063
00:35:34.585 --> 00:35:36.105
- confusing Google. So we don't have a great

1064
00:35:36.105 --> 00:35:38.505
- solution for that. But Right. Yeah. VHS video.

1065
00:35:38.664 --> 00:35:41.730
- Not that that big of a an ask

1066
00:35:41.730 --> 00:35:43.329
- because, you know, there's not a lot of

1067
00:35:43.329 --> 00:35:44.949
- shows doing that. I know,

1068
00:35:45.489 --> 00:35:45.989
- Todd's,

1069
00:35:46.369 --> 00:35:47.809
- Geek News Central had,

1070
00:35:48.210 --> 00:35:49.909
- an audio and a video feed,

1071
00:35:50.849 --> 00:35:53.429
- and and a new media show does still.

1072
00:35:53.525 --> 00:35:56.005
- But I I think once this HLS thing

1073
00:35:56.005 --> 00:35:58.324
- takes off, that'll get combined into one feed.

1074
00:35:58.324 --> 00:35:58.405
- And

1075
00:35:59.125 --> 00:36:00.724
- Exactly. I mean, that's sort of been my

1076
00:36:00.724 --> 00:36:02.505
- belief from the beginning is that

1077
00:36:02.965 --> 00:36:05.204
- there shouldn't be two feeds for Yeah. The

1078
00:36:05.204 --> 00:36:07.125
- same show. Right? There should be one feed

1079
00:36:07.125 --> 00:36:07.785
- that has

1080
00:36:09.019 --> 00:36:10.880
- you know, multiple multiple formats.

1081
00:36:11.339 --> 00:36:13.920
- And so Yeah. And that's, you know,

1082
00:36:14.219 --> 00:36:16.219
- that's probably how that's gonna go there with

1083
00:36:16.219 --> 00:36:17.280
- alternate enclosures.

1084
00:36:17.980 --> 00:36:19.500
- You know, you could have the video in

1085
00:36:19.500 --> 00:36:20.719
- the alternate, and

1086
00:36:21.905 --> 00:36:24.385
- that works. And, you know, there's there's a

1087
00:36:24.385 --> 00:36:27.025
- whole lot of permutations to this. I'm I'm

1088
00:36:27.025 --> 00:36:29.585
- anxious to see what what our customers are

1089
00:36:29.585 --> 00:36:31.925
- gonna do for, science experiments

1090
00:36:33.184 --> 00:36:34.644
- when all this stuff gets

1091
00:36:35.309 --> 00:36:38.530
- gets, fleshed out. But Yeah. Yeah. It's

1092
00:36:39.390 --> 00:36:40.829
- a it's a good thing. You know, the

1093
00:36:40.829 --> 00:36:42.750
- the whole idea of having a website in

1094
00:36:42.750 --> 00:36:44.510
- the first place is just to have a

1095
00:36:44.510 --> 00:36:45.650
- place where

1096
00:36:46.510 --> 00:36:48.369
- everything happens. You know?

1097
00:36:49.034 --> 00:36:49.534
- And,

1098
00:36:50.155 --> 00:36:52.315
- you know, we've always said that, you know,

1099
00:36:52.315 --> 00:36:54.234
- you need to have, as Todd used to

1100
00:36:54.234 --> 00:36:56.174
- call it, a moon base alpha.

1101
00:36:56.554 --> 00:36:57.214
- You know?

1102
00:36:57.755 --> 00:37:01.514
- Or, you know, like Spotify and YouTube and

1103
00:37:01.514 --> 00:37:02.494
- few other places

1104
00:37:03.360 --> 00:37:06.000
- might take us take your show down for

1105
00:37:06.000 --> 00:37:09.119
- whatever reason, technical reason or political reason or

1106
00:37:09.119 --> 00:37:09.619
- whatever.

1107
00:37:10.559 --> 00:37:11.059
- And

1108
00:37:12.240 --> 00:37:13.940
- you need to have a place where

1109
00:37:14.720 --> 00:37:17.119
- people will find you regardless of whether you

1110
00:37:17.119 --> 00:37:20.204
- got taken off Apple or taken off of

1111
00:37:20.204 --> 00:37:21.505
- Spotify or whatever.

1112
00:37:21.804 --> 00:37:24.125
- You know? And then, you know, there's multiple

1113
00:37:24.125 --> 00:37:26.144
- reasons for that kind of stuff, but,

1114
00:37:26.764 --> 00:37:28.364
- you know, that's the other one we always

1115
00:37:28.364 --> 00:37:30.864
- end up getting a lot of tickets about.

1116
00:37:31.404 --> 00:37:33.904
- Well, my episode's everywhere except for

1117
00:37:34.739 --> 00:37:37.159
- x, you know, platform, whatever platform,

1118
00:37:37.460 --> 00:37:40.440
- not not x Twitter, but just, you know,

1119
00:37:40.579 --> 00:37:43.139
- just a generic platform and, like, I don't

1120
00:37:43.139 --> 00:37:45.719
- know. You know? It's working everywhere else.

1121
00:37:46.099 --> 00:37:47.719
- I don't know what they did over there.

1122
00:37:48.579 --> 00:37:49.079
- So

1123
00:37:49.445 --> 00:37:51.684
- you believe there's 125

1124
00:37:51.684 --> 00:37:53.784
- places you can listen to a pod

1125
00:37:54.085 --> 00:37:54.585
- podcast?

1126
00:37:54.965 --> 00:37:57.204
- It's amazing. Yeah. And there's probably more than

1127
00:37:57.204 --> 00:37:58.565
- that. There's probably more I was gonna say.

1128
00:37:58.565 --> 00:37:59.864
- That actually seemed I mean,

1129
00:38:00.244 --> 00:38:01.380
- a 125

1130
00:38:01.460 --> 00:38:02.900
- official players would be like, okay. I get

1131
00:38:02.900 --> 00:38:04.299
- that. If there's but there's I was trying

1132
00:38:04.299 --> 00:38:05.539
- to explain this to someone the other day

1133
00:38:05.539 --> 00:38:06.679
- where I was like, your

1134
00:38:06.980 --> 00:38:08.119
- your podcast is

1135
00:38:08.900 --> 00:38:11.139
- limitless spots because whoever just wants to consume

1136
00:38:11.139 --> 00:38:13.139
- the fee can just publish it. There's no

1137
00:38:13.139 --> 00:38:15.779
- there's no gate to in most cases, most

1138
00:38:15.779 --> 00:38:17.079
- gate until I get. So

1139
00:38:17.715 --> 00:38:19.155
- it can be anywhere. And we always tell

1140
00:38:19.155 --> 00:38:20.835
- people about this, about their website because they

1141
00:38:20.835 --> 00:38:22.215
- have they'll have a website,

1142
00:38:22.675 --> 00:38:24.755
- but they don't put it on in their

1143
00:38:24.755 --> 00:38:26.195
- feed. So they don't go to their host

1144
00:38:26.195 --> 00:38:27.715
- and say, here's my official website. They just

1145
00:38:27.715 --> 00:38:30.215
- use whatever their host website is. And

1146
00:38:31.059 --> 00:38:33.299
- and I'm like, it's amazing opportunity to be

1147
00:38:33.299 --> 00:38:35.079
- able to do that because in most cases,

1148
00:38:35.139 --> 00:38:36.579
- backlinks are a huge pain in the ass

1149
00:38:36.579 --> 00:38:37.699
- to get. You know, you've got to go

1150
00:38:37.699 --> 00:38:39.059
- to some website and say, hey, can you

1151
00:38:39.059 --> 00:38:41.000
- can you link to my page? But

1152
00:38:41.460 --> 00:38:43.219
- with a podcast, as soon as you have,

1153
00:38:43.219 --> 00:38:44.900
- you know, you put your your feed or

1154
00:38:44.900 --> 00:38:46.304
- your website into the feed,

1155
00:38:46.704 --> 00:38:48.464
- you could be linked back to by hundreds

1156
00:38:48.464 --> 00:38:50.464
- of websites in a minute. So that's why

1157
00:38:50.464 --> 00:38:52.005
- when you put if you have a website

1158
00:38:52.144 --> 00:38:53.125
- and you add your custom

1159
00:38:53.585 --> 00:38:56.625
- domain, very quickly, your domain, your website can

1160
00:38:56.625 --> 00:38:58.144
- be the number one spot on Google that

1161
00:38:58.144 --> 00:39:00.464
- Google's pointing people to because, suddenly, Google's getting

1162
00:39:00.464 --> 00:39:01.764
- signal from everywhere

1163
00:39:02.230 --> 00:39:03.750
- that this is the place to go for

1164
00:39:03.750 --> 00:39:05.210
- information. And so,

1165
00:39:06.150 --> 00:39:08.150
- it's a huge missed opportunity when someone has

1166
00:39:08.150 --> 00:39:09.910
- gone to the trouble of creating a website,

1167
00:39:09.910 --> 00:39:11.590
- setting up a website, getting a domain, and

1168
00:39:11.590 --> 00:39:13.369
- then they don't add it to their podcast

1169
00:39:13.430 --> 00:39:13.930
- feed.

1170
00:39:15.035 --> 00:39:16.795
- So we do that check whenever someone logs

1171
00:39:16.795 --> 00:39:18.315
- into the pod page dashboard. We say, have

1172
00:39:18.315 --> 00:39:20.494
- you have you set this as your domain?

1173
00:39:20.715 --> 00:39:22.715
- Right. Because it's again, this you're just losing

1174
00:39:22.715 --> 00:39:24.954
- traffic, and you you can't expect this SEO

1175
00:39:24.954 --> 00:39:26.635
- to go up if you're not even putting

1176
00:39:26.635 --> 00:39:27.539
- it in your feed.

1177
00:39:28.099 --> 00:39:28.920
- Right. Yeah.

1178
00:39:29.300 --> 00:39:30.599
- SEO is getting harder

1179
00:39:31.140 --> 00:39:33.780
- anyway now with the all the AI stuff,

1180
00:39:33.780 --> 00:39:36.099
- but I I think the principles are all

1181
00:39:36.099 --> 00:39:37.079
- kind of the same.

1182
00:39:37.539 --> 00:39:39.860
- The what? The principles of, you know, how

1183
00:39:39.860 --> 00:39:41.880
- how to be found on an AI search

1184
00:39:41.940 --> 00:39:42.440
- versus,

1185
00:39:42.739 --> 00:39:44.534
- you know, standard SEO.

1186
00:39:44.914 --> 00:39:45.414
- Mhmm.

1187
00:39:45.875 --> 00:39:48.054
- I'm sure it's a bit different, but

1188
00:39:48.755 --> 00:39:50.675
- I think the principles are gonna be about

1189
00:39:50.675 --> 00:39:53.235
- the same as far as you know? For

1190
00:39:53.235 --> 00:39:55.094
- any of these things, any any

1191
00:39:55.795 --> 00:39:57.015
- anyone you say,

1192
00:39:58.099 --> 00:39:59.940
- tell me about your show, Cup of Trevor

1193
00:39:59.940 --> 00:40:02.500
- City. Right? Any and if you're asking Google,

1194
00:40:02.500 --> 00:40:04.519
- if you're asking OpenAI, if you're asking,

1195
00:40:05.780 --> 00:40:07.940
- me. Right? We're all trying to get we're

1196
00:40:07.940 --> 00:40:09.860
- all trying to we're all gonna try to

1197
00:40:09.860 --> 00:40:12.835
- get the information from the canonical source, the

1198
00:40:12.835 --> 00:40:14.434
- main place on the Internet to go for

1199
00:40:14.434 --> 00:40:16.835
- that information. Right? Like, I'm not gonna try

1200
00:40:16.835 --> 00:40:19.015
- to, you know, go to some other website

1201
00:40:19.474 --> 00:40:21.474
- to learn about it. Like, the first place

1202
00:40:21.474 --> 00:40:23.155
- I'm gonna go is show me your website.

1203
00:40:23.155 --> 00:40:24.614
- Like, if you're looking for hours,

1204
00:40:24.950 --> 00:40:26.550
- you know, the hours of a restaurant, you're

1205
00:40:26.550 --> 00:40:28.950
- probably better off going to the restaurant's website

1206
00:40:28.950 --> 00:40:30.550
- than you are or calling the restaurant than

1207
00:40:30.550 --> 00:40:31.990
- going to Yelp because Yelp, it might be

1208
00:40:31.990 --> 00:40:33.849
- out of date. Right? So

1209
00:40:34.550 --> 00:40:36.329
- all of this is like you

1210
00:40:36.869 --> 00:40:39.155
- all of the place the oracles you ask

1211
00:40:39.155 --> 00:40:40.914
- for information are all gonna say, well, what's

1212
00:40:40.914 --> 00:40:42.675
- the main spot I should get this information?

1213
00:40:42.675 --> 00:40:45.414
- And they're always gonna defer to someone's website

1214
00:40:45.635 --> 00:40:46.614
- Right. Over

1215
00:40:47.474 --> 00:40:50.114
- a directory listing because they know, like, if

1216
00:40:50.114 --> 00:40:52.434
- I'm gonna get information about Cup of Traverse

1217
00:40:52.434 --> 00:40:53.849
- City, is there a website out there called

1218
00:40:53.849 --> 00:40:55.690
- Cup of Traverse City? And is it about

1219
00:40:55.690 --> 00:40:57.530
- the pie oh, there is. Okay. Well, that's

1220
00:40:57.530 --> 00:40:59.289
- definitely gonna be the place that has the

1221
00:40:59.289 --> 00:41:00.590
- most accurate information.

1222
00:41:01.130 --> 00:41:01.869
- And so,

1223
00:41:02.489 --> 00:41:04.970
- whether you're Google or AI, you're gonna do

1224
00:41:04.970 --> 00:41:06.269
- the same thing. And so

1225
00:41:06.650 --> 00:41:06.730
- the

1226
00:41:07.474 --> 00:41:09.474
- with the difference ends up being and, again,

1227
00:41:09.474 --> 00:41:11.635
- here's another one of those things that we

1228
00:41:11.635 --> 00:41:13.795
- focus on, but a podcast host probably doesn't

1229
00:41:13.795 --> 00:41:15.795
- wanna go deep on. But, like, when you're

1230
00:41:15.795 --> 00:41:16.775
- setting up a website

1231
00:41:17.074 --> 00:41:17.815
- and you're

1232
00:41:18.195 --> 00:41:19.235
- you know? Yes. You can set up a

1233
00:41:19.235 --> 00:41:20.355
- website, and you can just write a bunch

1234
00:41:20.355 --> 00:41:21.030
- of text on it.

1235
00:41:21.909 --> 00:41:23.210
- But if you want Google

1236
00:41:23.510 --> 00:41:25.429
- to have a better shot in understanding what

1237
00:41:25.429 --> 00:41:27.349
- the website is, there's all kinds of hidden

1238
00:41:27.349 --> 00:41:28.890
- tags you put through the code.

1239
00:41:30.070 --> 00:41:31.670
- You know, things like, hey. Here's what here's

1240
00:41:31.670 --> 00:41:33.750
- the transcript. This is a transcript for a

1241
00:41:33.750 --> 00:41:36.344
- podcast episode. The podcast episode it is a

1242
00:41:36.344 --> 00:41:39.005
- transcript for is part of this podcast series.

1243
00:41:39.304 --> 00:41:41.224
- And there's all this code that no one

1244
00:41:41.224 --> 00:41:43.065
- ever sees that's hidden in there because it

1245
00:41:43.065 --> 00:41:45.065
- doesn't even show on the website. It's literally

1246
00:41:45.065 --> 00:41:47.559
- just just for the robots to read, and

1247
00:41:47.559 --> 00:41:49.639
- it's structured in a way that makes it

1248
00:41:49.639 --> 00:41:51.159
- easy for the robots to read. So when

1249
00:41:51.159 --> 00:41:52.440
- Google goes to the page, they don't have

1250
00:41:52.440 --> 00:41:53.799
- to do a lot of work, and no

1251
00:41:53.799 --> 00:41:55.319
- robot not no one wants to do more

1252
00:41:55.319 --> 00:41:56.920
- work than they need to. So you've got

1253
00:41:56.920 --> 00:41:58.760
- all this stuff that you're doing for Google

1254
00:41:58.760 --> 00:42:00.599
- already, and they publish. They say, hey. If

1255
00:42:00.599 --> 00:42:02.775
- you want, you know, sometimes you'll search for

1256
00:42:02.775 --> 00:42:05.815
- something and Google have, like, the you know,

1257
00:42:05.815 --> 00:42:07.655
- a structured information at the top in the

1258
00:42:07.655 --> 00:42:08.554
- form of questions.

1259
00:42:09.014 --> 00:42:10.614
- Like, if you click in there, all of

1260
00:42:10.614 --> 00:42:12.295
- those have sources. And the reason those should

1261
00:42:12.295 --> 00:42:13.894
- flow to the top is because the sources

1262
00:42:13.894 --> 00:42:16.460
- have structured those questions to be answered. Right?

1263
00:42:16.460 --> 00:42:18.380
- So anyway, pod page does all that and

1264
00:42:18.380 --> 00:42:20.299
- has always done all that for Google. And

1265
00:42:20.299 --> 00:42:23.039
- that's why our websites rank so high. But

1266
00:42:23.099 --> 00:42:24.960
- now in the age of AI agents

1267
00:42:25.260 --> 00:42:28.319
- and Claude and, OpenAI, they they're

1268
00:42:28.954 --> 00:42:30.315
- asking the same. They go to the same

1269
00:42:30.315 --> 00:42:32.074
- website and ask the same questions and write.

1270
00:42:32.074 --> 00:42:33.755
- And, you know, the default is we'll just

1271
00:42:33.755 --> 00:42:35.514
- read all the code that Google has always

1272
00:42:35.514 --> 00:42:36.014
- read,

1273
00:42:36.315 --> 00:42:39.195
- but there's a, there's additional code that you

1274
00:42:39.195 --> 00:42:39.675
- can add,

1275
00:42:41.000 --> 00:42:43.480
- into a website into a web page, meaning

1276
00:42:43.480 --> 00:42:45.339
- like a single page and also a website.

1277
00:42:45.799 --> 00:42:47.739
- Mhmm. With Google, it's a site map

1278
00:42:48.119 --> 00:42:50.119
- that tells you where all the links are,

1279
00:42:50.119 --> 00:42:52.119
- and there's a different file that you can

1280
00:42:52.119 --> 00:42:54.440
- provide to Google, Claude and catchy p t.

1281
00:42:54.440 --> 00:42:56.545
- And that that stuff is like, if you

1282
00:42:56.545 --> 00:42:59.425
- do it, they're more likely to understand your

1283
00:42:59.425 --> 00:42:59.925
- website.

1284
00:43:00.465 --> 00:43:02.224
- And so, again, these are things that we

1285
00:43:02.224 --> 00:43:02.724
- do,

1286
00:43:03.344 --> 00:43:05.265
- that, you know, are best practices, and we're

1287
00:43:05.265 --> 00:43:06.545
- learning, you know, on a almost on a

1288
00:43:06.545 --> 00:43:08.804
- daily basis, some new thing for AI

1289
00:43:09.320 --> 00:43:11.480
- comes out that we need to Yeah. And

1290
00:43:11.480 --> 00:43:13.800
- that's definitely not something we do here at

1291
00:43:13.800 --> 00:43:14.300
- Blueberry.

1292
00:43:15.079 --> 00:43:17.320
- Yeah. But, like, the fundamentals are the same

1293
00:43:17.320 --> 00:43:18.780
- where it's like you just need

1294
00:43:19.800 --> 00:43:21.239
- you need to do it if you want

1295
00:43:21.239 --> 00:43:23.480
- these things, if you wanted to understand what's

1296
00:43:23.480 --> 00:43:24.460
- going on. So,

1297
00:43:25.474 --> 00:43:26.594
- anyway, yeah, it's a,

1298
00:43:27.474 --> 00:43:29.554
- it's it's a fun it's it's sort of

1299
00:43:29.554 --> 00:43:31.635
- a fun world to continue to iterate. And

1300
00:43:31.635 --> 00:43:33.335
- we we're seeing more and more traffic

1301
00:43:33.875 --> 00:43:34.614
- come from,

1302
00:43:36.275 --> 00:43:37.175
- AI agents

1303
00:43:37.554 --> 00:43:38.594
- Yeah. Then

1304
00:43:39.155 --> 00:43:40.429
- I mean, mean, it's just it's just going

1305
00:43:40.429 --> 00:43:42.029
- up, and it will keep going up. So

1306
00:43:42.190 --> 00:43:42.690
- Yeah.

1307
00:43:44.190 --> 00:43:44.929
- Well, anyway,

1308
00:43:45.309 --> 00:43:47.710
- I I think we've covered pretty much what

1309
00:43:47.710 --> 00:43:49.309
- we wanted to. Is there anything else you

1310
00:43:49.309 --> 00:43:51.710
- wanted to say? No. Like I said, it's

1311
00:43:51.710 --> 00:43:53.815
- been really fun to this project has been

1312
00:43:53.815 --> 00:43:55.815
- really great. It's been fun to to launch

1313
00:43:55.815 --> 00:43:57.574
- all this stuff. And if you're a Blueberry

1314
00:43:57.574 --> 00:43:58.074
- customer

1315
00:43:58.454 --> 00:44:00.375
- with your new landing page, like, the best

1316
00:44:00.375 --> 00:44:02.635
- thing you could do as far as our

1317
00:44:02.775 --> 00:44:05.655
- partnership is concerned Mhmm. Is give a lot

1318
00:44:05.655 --> 00:44:06.795
- of critical feedback,

1319
00:44:07.559 --> 00:44:08.539
- constructive criticism,

1320
00:44:09.640 --> 00:44:11.640
- to the Blueberry team about what you would

1321
00:44:11.640 --> 00:44:13.640
- like how things should be could be different

1322
00:44:13.640 --> 00:44:15.800
- or better. And come over, and if you're

1323
00:44:15.800 --> 00:44:17.880
- interested, come go through the process of claiming

1324
00:44:17.880 --> 00:44:18.780
- your pod page,

1325
00:44:19.094 --> 00:44:21.014
- and then tell the PodPage team what could

1326
00:44:21.094 --> 00:44:22.775
- we could be doing better. Because, you know,

1327
00:44:22.775 --> 00:44:24.054
- this is a first for both of us,

1328
00:44:24.054 --> 00:44:26.695
- and we're we wanna make it easy and,

1329
00:44:26.695 --> 00:44:28.695
- like, a a good experience on both sides.

1330
00:44:28.695 --> 00:44:30.215
- We want the sum of these two parts

1331
00:44:30.215 --> 00:44:32.519
- to be better than them separately. So Right.

1332
00:44:32.519 --> 00:44:34.920
- And the the claiming process is pretty easy.

1333
00:44:34.920 --> 00:44:37.640
- Just go to the dashboard and and the

1334
00:44:37.640 --> 00:44:40.660
- manage show area, look for landing page, and

1335
00:44:40.679 --> 00:44:41.800
- there'll be a little button And we we

1336
00:44:41.800 --> 00:44:43.800
- built those sign in with Blueberry connections, so

1337
00:44:43.800 --> 00:44:45.079
- you don't even have to come over and

1338
00:44:45.079 --> 00:44:46.679
- create a new username and password. You just

1339
00:44:46.679 --> 00:44:48.894
- sign in with your existing Blueberry account. Account.

1340
00:44:48.894 --> 00:44:51.554
- Yep. Yep. So they that's even handier.

1341
00:44:51.934 --> 00:44:54.194
- Yeah. Hopefully, it's smooth. Yeah. Yeah.

1342
00:44:54.494 --> 00:44:57.694
- So, well, anyway, thanks for being on, Brandon.

1343
00:44:57.694 --> 00:44:58.194
- And,

1344
00:44:58.894 --> 00:45:01.534
- you said if, you're a Blueberry customer or

1345
00:45:01.534 --> 00:45:04.103
- wanna be a Blueberry customer, come check it

1346
00:45:04.103 --> 00:45:04.603
- out.

1347
00:45:05.382 --> 00:45:05.882
- Cool.

1348
00:45:06.343 --> 00:45:06.843
- Awesome.

1349
00:45:07.543 --> 00:45:09.483
- Thank you so much. Thanks for having me.

1350
00:45:09.623 --> 00:45:10.123
- Yep.